Crypto Crime Cartel: BitMEX, Kraken, Binance, Bitcoin.com ...

08-16 23:55 - 'I use kraken, coinbase/coinbase Pro and binance mainly. Most funds I transfer via revolut so my bank doesn't get funny. / If you plan on using binance feel free to use my referral code LGTCIPKF and feel free to ask me any ques...' by /u/C-tali removed from /r/Bitcoin within 108-118min

'''
I use kraken, coinbase/coinbase Pro and binance mainly. Most funds I transfer via revolut so my bank doesn't get funny.
If you plan on using binance feel free to use my referral code LGTCIPKF and feel free to ask me any questions
'''
Context Link
Go1dfish undelete link
unreddit undelete link
Author: C-tali
submitted by removalbot to removalbot [link] [comments]

Bitcoin mentioned around Reddit: Funny pic about Bitcoin adoption /r/binance

Bitcoin mentioned around Reddit: Funny pic about Bitcoin adoption /binance submitted by SimilarAdvantage to BitcoinAll [link] [comments]

Fastest and easiest way without a minimum purchase or high fees for customers to obtain NANO? (USA)

Hello Nano community,
Some of you may know me from /nanotrade or elsewhere, I generally am bullish on NANO and try to do my part to help spread adoption and awareness. I also run several e-commerce websites utilizing the open source Zen-Cart as my back end. Lately, and not so lately but in general, I have encountered issues with various payment processors (which actually led me to Nano in the first place, as well as a general interest in Cryptocurrency).
While there are solutions to dealing with the more stringent regulations enforced by payment processing companies, many of these require my customers to download third party apps or sign up for third party services. Not too dissimilar to how Paypal requests a user to be logged in before sending a payment in fact. Anyways, so while setting up my websites again today after losing another payment processor over the weekend, I have come to the decision, why not try and introduce my customer base to Nano and present it less so as a cryptocurrency, but more so as a digital decentralized payment solution? I have tried accepting cryptocurrencies before, however many of my customers, at least for my main e-commerce website are older and not so tech oriented. Just seeing that I accepted "Cryptocurrency" and "Bitcoin" as an option was enough to scare some of these people away. Ironically, I noticed more sales when I completely removed this payment option and all mentions of it from my website. Funny how that works.
Anyways, since I am in the middle of setting up additional payment methods, I figured now would be a good time to attempt the above with Nano, and offer a link on the "Pay with Nano" page during the check-out process for my customers to decide if they would like to try it out. My only concern, many of these people being older and technophobic, is that the process for obtaining the Nano they want to spend may be too much work and not something they would be interested in. Especially if it involves things like scanning IDs or providing more information than a simple credit or debit card number and a name. Ideally, this would be the only information they need to provide, with the ability to purchase any amount (most orders placed are between $25-$100), without paying an outrageous fee (which I will offer an incentive to cover for anyways I think). An instant transfer would also be a prerequisite. Something as fast as it takes to sign up for Cash App for example.
So, am I asking too much? Do such services exist yet in the US?
Quick rundown:
-Low fees
-No minimum or low minimum
-Non-invasive signup process
-No wait
Another thing worth mentioning, and hopefully this can provide the right people with an idea which I think could really help improve Nano adoption if implemented, was that I noticed some competitors of mine are accepting something called "PMC Coin", which is claimed to be a gold backed cryptocurrency. The gold bit is not important I do not think. What is impressive however, is that these vendors are able to provide this crypto as an option during the checkout process, and upon hitting submit, the customer is brought to the PMC Coin website, where they are presented with a form for purchasing this crypto. I have not tried going further than this, but the form contains all the required fields for a credit and debit purchase, as well as the price for the purchase being exactly what the price was for the requested items during the check-out on the forwarding website. It appears that upon purchase, the credit/debit card payment is sent to the PMC Coin sellers, and the PMC Coin in an equivalent amount is sent to the vendor. I assume the fees are offloaded onto the vendor at this point. While I have no interest in this asset in the slightest, I have to commend them on this solution, and I really hope we can see something like this emerge from the Nano community. It could be the killer app we have all been waiting for to spur adoption perhaps.
I will essentially be manually doing something like this for my customers, albeit with links and instructions, however as mentioned, the more streamlined the process is, the better. I am sure they will have an easy enough time with Natrium, and I am excited to introduce some new people into the space. But most of all I just want a simple ability to be able to keep my shop online without having to bow down to the banks and their petty requests as to what products should or should not be sold. None of us should have to deal with the Soup Nazi, be us merchants or consumers.
Thank you for your time and interest, and remember, stay bullish!
::edit::
Spreads I have found so-far:
CoinGate: 100 Nano = $114.76 vs. $97.44 USDT (Binance) [$17.32 fee] [$50 minimum] (Simplex)
Atomic Wallet: 100 Nano = $115 vs. $98.40 USDT (Binance) [$16.60 fee] [$50 minimum] (Simplex)
Crypto.com: Claims 3.5% fee, requires government photo ID, 2-3 day confirmation
Coinswitch.io: 100 Nano = $117 vs. $99.28 USDT (Binance) [$17.72 fee] [$63 minimum] (Simplex)
Coinify.com: 100 Nano = $119 vs. $114 USDT (Binance) [$5 fee] [$63 minimum] KYC is intensive but not too crazy. 2 Minute verification too. Definitely the best option so far. Only problem is the minimum purchase.
Going to try Binance.us next and the Brave browser, which I think uses Binance as a backend anyways.
submitted by ExtraSynaptic to nanocurrency [link] [comments]

"Say we got hacked"

submitted by mushhhhh to Bitcoin [link] [comments]

Binance scammed me 1516 USDT with unethical verification requests! Stay Away from this Scam Exchance!

**************************************************************EDIT from 04/24/20:
read directly here the latest discussion per Email with Symbiotic and the final stage of the BINANCE SCAM:Part 1:
https://www.reddit.com/Bitcoin/comments/g08w53/binance_scammed_me_1516_usdt_with_unethical/fodphld?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x
Part 2:
https://www.reddit.com/Bitcoin/comments/g08w53/binance_scammed_me_1516_usdt_with_unethical/fodskqw?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x
PART 3: https://www.reddit.com/Bitcoin/comments/g08w53/binance_scammed_me_1516_usdt_with_unethical/fodxud3?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x
***************************************************************
Following the discussion here with u/symbiotic_bnb on binance BinanceExchange
Please read the complete story here:
https://np.reddit.com/binance/comments/g01kig/binance_scammed_me_1516_usdt_with_unethical/
Then I'm replying to the official comment made here:https://np.reddit.com/binance/comments/g01kig/binance_scammed_me_1516_usdt_with_unethical/fn83ixw/
IThe reason why I'm giving more details here is that u/symbiotic_bnb banned me from their board so that I couldn't comment his reply and provide more information about the unethical requests made by their exchance binance
Here my answer:
Please feel free to spread the information. I will contact more media if they don't want to fix this.
---
Thanks u/symbiotic_bnb for having banned me from your board binance BinanceExchange. However I will reply on other boards to let everyone know about your abuse.
You wrote:
"Risk Control." This can mean many things, and most often it simply means that we have identified unusual activity on your account that may indicate a third-party has gained unauthorized access and withdrawals were suspended to protect your assets.
Nice. So I remember the steps done:
  1. Last year opened my Tier 0 account (Non verified, just Email, 2FA set)
  2. on same day deposited 0.21BTC
  3. 3-4 months later back, I login to my account from a new machine, but same country. I m asked to verify email, I receive code, login successully, same 2FA.
  4. I sell some of assets, then I withdraw you cancel it for "Risk control" and force me to upgrade my account??? why???? seriously???
If you dont want people to use Level 0 accounts (unverified with KYC, 2 BTC limit), then just don't offer that option!! force everyone from scratch to submit KYC. Simple!
Don't allow people to use the service, then randomly you force them to provide verification. We have a right of privacy !
And now if you force me to verify my account to be able to withdraw my funds, it's my right to choose HOW I verify it. Regardless if my son, brother or sister or whoever does it for me, its verified! End! Now I know you will call this "illegal" but what you are doing is as well illegal in this case! Don't try to find bs reasons for that behaviour.
Your forced me to verify my account, so my account has been verified, as my screenshot is showing. Don't create new reasons to keep my money by asking things I can't provide.
When you ask me to provide video recording of how I load btc in my account, 4 months back, how sick is this? It sounds for me as a torture to find ways to keep money of people. A kind of trap.
You comment:
Case in point: is there a particular reason why someone else attempted to KYC your account a day before your attempt? Typically, legitimate customers do not cycle through various individuals for their KYC attempts. It's interesting that you made no mention of this anywhere, given how obvious it is that this is cause for concern, especially considering that the other individual that submitted KYC for "your" account has been involved in malicious activity on our platform.
First, what do you mean here with "legitmate customer"?? I was using, as your system allows, an unverified account, which was more than enough for my needs. So what is then "legimate customer"?? So do you mean now, all your users who don't have level 2 verified accounts are not legtimate? interesting point...
Now about the verification which has been done after your "illegal" action to force me to upgrade the account to be able to access my account, only because I changed the machine.
Indeed 2 verifications have been done. The first verification has been rejected by Binance because the passport was not the latest updated passport of my country. Though the passport is still valid, binance verification rejected it. So what option did I have from that moment? I spoke with customer service and they couldn't help.
So what should I have done from that moment? Just abandon my hard earned money with binance for this? Even the drive license was rejected. It's a lot of money. So I asked my friend who had a newer passport to verify the account for me. And the account was verified successfully!
If you call this "illegal", then you are not different at all, you are exactly the same! You lock customers in a wheel while having their money, then forcing them to upgrade to level 2. This is illegal! Then you again you complain when the account is finally verified!
Next you start asking what customers can't provide to have a way to keep the money.
That said, Binance has no interest in "stealing" anything from any of its customers, but we surely aren't going to allow bad actors to freely operate on our platform. You may simply respond to the ticket from here forth.
really? so you are the good actor and I m the bad actor right? Congratulations! :-)
Sorry this does not give you the right to keep my coins. If so, it's simply called SCAM. You don't like me? No problem, give me my money, and close my account.
Don't find pretexts to keep the money for you.
Imagine that this exchange is doing this shit every day, randomly to customers, customers who don't want to provide their KYC (and it's their right! don't call them bad actor! You are Superman!) will simply abandon their money, do you know how many boost revenue is it for them? Nice way to make money u/symbiotic_bnb BinanceExchange
For any normal customer reading this, support is extremely busy due to recent market conditions and new interest pouring into the market and some tickets may take longer than intended to address, but that doesn't mean that there is any ill intent behind the delay. If you go an extended amount of time, such as 3+ days, with no response to your ticket, you may speak with the live support on our website and request an update.
Sorry but I have been patient enough! After I opened the ticket, your CS was fast enough to reply and make insane and unethical request. Since it has been 12 days, that I sent different emails, no response. Now you found better excuse! When you contact live support, they said "in few hours you will get answer".
If you are unable to provide anything that customer support asks for, all you need to do is respond to the ticket and explain what you are unable to provide and why you are unable to provide it. There are procedures in place for nearly every situation, support does not simply give up after the first step if a customer is unable to provide something that is not always guaranteed to be known.
Objection! I already replied, 12 days, no single answer from your team. What other option did I have?? See the screenshots I posted earlier, its clear enough!
Posting on Reddit is the last stop once all other options have failed. Keep in mind that you do not need to embellish or over-exaggerate your situation to get assistance. Simply be reasonable and you will receive the same in return.
Exactly! All other options to solve this issue directly with you have failed! I have to tell my story here. And see, you replied fast.... 12 days you / your CS didn't reply to my emails.
You asked me to be reasonable? I think I'm very reasonable. Treat well your customers and with respect if you want to get the same in return. Simple life's rule.
You can scam me if you want. I expect you to release my money and close my account. This is the correct way if your company is serious.
Bitcoin BinanceExchange CryptoCurrency CryptoCurrencyTrading CryptoScam CryptoScamAlert CryptoScamsVictims
EDIT: When I asked to u/symbiotic_bnb why they banned me from their board, see the answer:
The answer to every single on of your questions here is answered within my comment. People that come to our subreddit, over-exaggerate their situation, and spread FUD, especially by way of ridiculous conspiracy theories, are not welcome. Respond to the ticket as your were advised and we aill proceed accordingly with verifying the details of your case.
Screenshot: https://i.imgur.com/B1MYT0U.png
Very funny, so I m spreading "ridiculous conspiracy theories"?? wow very nice :-)
And they are asking me to respond to the ticket? lol how many times should I respond? I'm telling that I responded alredy 12 days ago, and sent many reminders, they simply ignored. very funnny lol
submitted by churgercold to Bitcoin [link] [comments]

Removed comments/submissions for /u/TheCryptoKang

Hi TheCryptoKang, you're not shadowbanned, but 26 of your most recent 159 comments/submissions were removed (either automatically or by human moderators).

Comments:

ft003pf in LINKTrader on 05 Jun 20 (1pts):
In the end they'll be two coins at the top
fszykyr in CryptoCurrency on 05 Jun 20 (1pts):
Defi is going to be fueling the next bubble that's for sure
fg3jf72 in GenderCritical on 31 Jan 20 (0pts):
You're wasting your time seriously these people don't want the truth they want to feel better about being useless to society
fg3iien in GenderCritical on 31 Jan 20 (0pts):
It wasn't easier because you didnt have readily available textbooks and classes to go and learn what you needed. Stop minimising the achievements of people that were far better than you ever will be.
fdkx8ka in CryptoMarkets on 08 Jan 20 (1pts):
It's a bulltrap, as seen here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uuve47c5HN8
f7bpd5t in brakebills on 12 Nov 19 (-1pts):
2019 everyone people need to write walls of texts when they disagree with someone. Life advice: Keep it short because no one cares. It goes without saying that I didn't read a single word.
f77r4kb in brakebills on 11 Nov 19 (0pts):
Jesus set your priorities straight your are complaining to random strangers about a mini game online not working the way you want it to... need I go on? Youre most likely 30years old + too
f571p9j in CryptoCurrency on 25 Oct 19 (1pts):
Yikes
f1x71e9 in TwoXChromosomes on 29 Sep 19 (1pts):
Nice larp op lmao post proof of the “Bitchionary” for the lads please
evrr4jf in LINKTrader on 02 Aug 19 (1pts):
Lmao
eux6ero in LINKTrader on 25 Jul 19 (1pts):
They should make a competition with "play" money like bitforex did tbh that was fun
eufrs64 in forwardsfromhitler on 22 Jul 19 (1pts):
You must be really stupid if you're not trolling.
eudohrt in RobinHood on 21 Jul 19 (1pts):
totally missread the Q my bad lmao. Its been a good experience for me but Ive also been it from the start so its easy to say
eudodvy in RobinHood on 21 Jul 19 (1pts):
You should try bitforex or binance. bitforex has a fake money competition for new users to get used to it and binance has a chainlink competition which is also good but requires a decent stack
eso14zb in LINKTrader on 03 Jul 19 (1pts):
If you have a 10k stack and are not registered on linkarium idk wtf you're doing
esnzvno in CryptoCurrency on 03 Jul 19 (1pts):
Lmaooo
esny32i in CryptoCurrency on 03 Jul 19 (1pts):
Lmao
eslt29q in LINKTrader on 02 Jul 19 (1pts):
Please message me too
ese4goc in CryptoCurrency on 30 Jun 19 (1pts):
This, plus its just a simple jason parser
ese0cyp in CryptoCurrency on 30 Jun 19 (1pts):
Hahahahahahahaha.
esd68n7 in CryptoCurrency on 29 Jun 19 (1pts):
http://linkarium.link
e0vu4eh in funny on 18 Jun 18 (1pts):
in all of his relationships, his SO had male friends
he now is single
Kekkkk I wonder why
e0vtdul in funny on 18 Jun 18 (1pts):
Lowest iq response I ever had the displeasure to read here. Bravo

Submissions:

em0suk in BitcoinMarkets on 08 Jan 20 (1pts):
A short video on this recent pump and what it means for us
c8ndlv in LINKTrader on 03 Jul 19 (1pts):
Linkarium
8cfwgf in PowerLedger on 15 Apr 18 (8pts):
POWR Merch giveaway
I'm a bot. My home is at /CommentRemovalChecker - check if your posts have been removed! (How to use)
Help us expose and stand up to social media bias and censorship!
submitted by MarkdownShadowBot to CommentRemovalChecker [link] [comments]

Your Position Has Been Liquidated

I remember reading the post about the guy who almost lost 200btcs. I remember reading the post about the guy who had to quit crypto because he lost it all.
It all sounded funny. "Hah. Noobs!", I thought. They mentioned they lost margin trading, and so I began learning about it.
Such potential! I could double my btc in minutes rather than waiting weeks for an altcoin to pump! I promised myself I would be extremely careful with it and not make stupid greed trades.
After 2 days, I lost 0.3btc. I had 0.7Btc left. Not the end.
I deposit 0.3 more btc. After 1 day, I lose half of it. Then, i manage to go from about 0.15 to 0.6 btc in like 2 days. I got super excited and confident. I could beat the market!
The same day, I go all in with one trade. I wait for a small pump to confirm that a pump will happen indeed. The small pump happens, I go all in. The next second, a crazy flash dump happens.
0.1 left. I transfer my last 0.4 from binance to Bitmex. This was 2 days ago
Guess what happened next?
In 2017, I had 150k in crypto. After the market crash, I was left with 1 bitcoin. 1 bitcoin that i held for 2 years. 2 years gone in about 2 weeks.
I cannot imagine how many people will lose their savings when binance opens up margin trading. So many people already do in Bitmex alone.
What hurts is not losing my portfolio. What hurts is knowing I will probably miss the crypto bull market while I work in a shitty job and try to make it all back.
submitted by Dimax88 to BitcoinMarkets [link] [comments]

Coinbase has secretly changed their terms for bank transfers from May 2nd and people are falling victim to predatory practices.

See these threads for similar issues:
https://np.www.reddit.com/CoinBase/comments/8i7bzu/all_of_a_sudden_i_have_to_wait_5_days_to_send/
https://np.www.reddit.com/Bitcoin/comments/bmz9u6/uk_bank_transfers_to_coinbase_big_changes_to_rules/
Among many others.
The process used to be - send money to Coinbase, let's say £100. When you send via bank transfer it turns up within the hour and then you deposit that into Coinbase Pro (formerly GDAX) and then send on to Binance or wherever, overall fees were like... 15p
Now, when you deposit into Coinbase, the funds are locked for 5 days, for UK, EU and US customers. You are totally unable to move them to Coinbase Pro, so your only choice is to convert direct to ETH or BTC from Coinbase and eat a fee that's something like 4%.
Email support gives you this line:
For your account’s security and to prevent any potential fraudulent activity, you will be unable to withdraw these funds or send the value of this deposit from Coinbase for 5 calendars days after deposit.
Which is funny, because I can just convert it to BTC or ETH straight on Coinbase and then send it wherever I please.
So if I was accessing John Smith's account fraudulently, I could transfer his money into his Coinbase account, swap it for BTC and shoot it off to anywhere in the world within the hour.
This does NOTHING for safety and security, it's simply a means for Coinbase to force you into eating their 4% fee. In fact, you can't even withdraw back to your bank account. Your money is literally stuck for 5 days in Limbo and the only way to "Get out of Jail" early is to pay the 4% fee.
Coinbase, fuck you. I'm not using this shit any more.
For anyone in the UK, get a free Revolut account, aside from being an awesome travel card, you can send GBP and exchange it to Euro instantly at an Interbank exchange rate. Then send this Euro to Bitstamp where you have the freedom to exchange it for many different Crypto's and send those on to Binance or your exchange of choice for a miniscule fee.
Fuck you Coinbase.
submitted by TNGSystems to CryptoCurrency [link] [comments]

Binance scammed me 1516 USDT with unethical verification requests! Stay Away from this Scam Exchance!


Following the post made here https://www.reddit.com/binance/comments/g01kig/_/fn83ixw
Please read the complete story here:
https://np.reddit.com/binance/comments/g01kig/binance_scammed_me_1516_usdt_with_unethical/
Thanks u/symbiotic_bnb for having banned me from your board binance BinanceExchange so that I can't reply anymore.

So I have decided to create my own community now. I hope other victims of your exchange will join this community and share their experience here.
For my current case you can review all the discussion here:
You wrote:
"Risk Control." This can mean many things, and most often it simply means that we have identified unusual activity on your account that may indicate a third-party has gained unauthorized access and withdrawals were suspended to protect your assets.
Nice. So I remember the steps done:
1) Last year opened my Tier 0 account (Non verified, just Email, 2FA set)
2) on same day deposited 0.21BTC
3) 3-4 months later back, I login to my account from a new machine, but same country. I m asked to verify email, I receive code, login successully, same 2FA.
4) I sell some of assets, then I withdraw you cancel it for "Risk control" and force me to upgrade my account??? why???? seriously???
If you dont want people to use Level 0 accounts (unverified with KYC, 2 BTC limit), then just don't offer that option!! force everyone from scratch to submit KYC. Simple!
Don't allow people to use the service, then randomly you force them to provide verification. We have a right of privacy !
And now if you force me to verify my account to be able to withdraw my funds, it's my right to choose HOW I verify it. Regardless if my son, brother or sister or whoever does it for me, its verified! End! Now I know you will call this "illegal" but what you are doing is as well illegal in this case! Don't try to find bs reasons for that behaviour.

Your forced me to verify my account, so my account has been verified, as my screenshot is showing. Don't create new reasons to keep my money by asking things I can't provide.
When you ask me to provide video recording of how I load btc in my account, 4 months back, how sick is this? It sounds for me as a torture to find ways to keep money of people. A kind of trap.

You comment:
Case in point: is there a particular reason why someone else attempted to KYC your account a day before your attempt? Typically, legitimate customers do not cycle through various individuals for their KYC attempts. It's interesting that you made no mention of this anywhere, given how obvious it is that this is cause for concern, especially considering that the other individual that submitted KYC for "your" account has been involved in malicious activity on our platform.
First, what do you mean here with "legitmate customer"?? I was using, as your system allows, an unverified account, which was more than enough for my needs. So what is then "legimate customer"?? So do you mean now, all your users who don't have level 2 verified accounts are not legtimate? interesting point...
Now about the verification which has been done after your "illegal" action to force me to upgrade the account to be able to access my account, only because I changed the machine.
Indeed 2 verifications have been done. The first verification has been rejected by Binance because the passport was not the latest updated passport of my country. Though the passport is still valid, binance verification rejected it. So what option did I have from that moment? I spoke with customer service and they couldn't help.
So what should I have done from that moment? Just abandon my hard earned money with binance for this? Even the drive license was rejected. It's a lot of money. So I asked my friend who had a newer passport to verify the account for me. And the account was verified successfully!
If you call this "illegal", then you are not different at all, you are exactly the same! You lock customers in a wheel while having their money, then forcing them to upgrade to level 2. This is illegal! Then you again you complain when the account is finally verified!
Next you start asking what customers can't provide to have a way to keep the money.

That said, Binance has no interest in "stealing" anything from any of its customers, but we surely aren't going to allow bad actors to freely operate on our platform. You may simply respond to the ticket from here forth.
really? so you are the good actor and I m the bad actor right? Congratulations! :-)
Sorry this does not give you the right to keep my coins. If so, it's simply called SCAM. You don't like me? No problem, give me my money, and close my account.
Don't find pretexts to keep the money for you.
Imagine that this exchange is doing this shit every day, randomly to customers, customers who don't want to provide their KYC (and it's their right! don't call them bad actor! You are Superman!) will simply abandon their money, do you know how many boost revenue is it for them? Nice way to make money u/symbiotic_bnb BinanceExchange

For any normal customer reading this, support is extremely busy due to recent market conditions and new interest pouring into the market and some tickets may take longer than intended to address, but that doesn't mean that there is any ill intent behind the delay. If you go an extended amount of time, such as 3+ days, with no response to your ticket, you may speak with the live support on our website and request an update.
Sorry but I have been patient enough! After I opened the ticket, your CS was fast enough to reply and make insane and unethical request. Since it has been 12 days, that I sent different emails, no response. Now you found better excuse! When you contact live support, they said "in few hours you will get answer".

If you are unable to provide anything that customer support asks for, all you need to do is respond to the ticket and explain what you are unable to provide and why you are unable to provide it. There are procedures in place for nearly every situation, support does not simply give up after the first step if a customer is unable to provide something that is not always guaranteed to be known.
Objection! I already replied, 12 days, no single answer from your team. What other option did I have?? See the screenshots I posted earlier, its clear enough!

Posting on Reddit is the last stop once all other options have failed. Keep in mind that you do not need to embellish or over-exaggerate your situation to get assistance. Simply be reasonable and you will receive the same in return.
Exactly! All other options to solve this issue directly with you have failed! I have to tell my story here. And see, you replied fast.... 12 days you / your CS didn't reply to my emails.
You asked me to be reasonable? I think I'm very reasonable. Treat well your customers and with respect if you want to get the same in return. Simple life's rule.
You can scam me if you want. I expect you to release my money and close my account. This is the correct way if your company is serious.

Bitcoin BinanceExchange CryptoCurrency CryptoCurrencyTrading CryptoScam CryptoScamAlert CryptoScamsVictims

EDIT: When I asked to u/symbiotic_bnb why they banned me from their board, see the answer:
The answer to every single on of your questions here is answered within my comment. People that come to our subreddit, over-exaggerate their situation, and spread FUD, especially by way of ridiculous conspiracy theories, are not welcome. Respond to the ticket as your were advised and we aill proceed accordingly with verifying the details of your case.
Screenshot: https://i.imgur.com/B1MYT0U.png
Very funny, so I m spreading "ridiculous conspiracy theories"?? wow very nice :-)
And they are asking me to respond to the ticket? lol how many times should I respond? I'm telling that I responded alredy 12 days ago, and sent many reminders, they simply ignored. very funnny lol
Let's see what will happen next.
submitted by churgercold to BinanceExchangeScam [link] [comments]

[Daily BAT Discussion] Purgatory - June 25, 2019

June 25, 2019
Hey BAT folks! Welcome to the Daily BAT Discussion!
If you're a new publisher, feel free to post your website/channel here!
Yesterday's Market Movements: Sideways/Down-ish
As Bitcoin soars into the $11k area, we continue to drop against it, dropping another one or two hundred sats down to 2800 satoshis. Funny enough, our USD price remains in the $0.32-$0.33 zone no matter what Bitcoin does. Interestingly, when we hit 2800 sats, the volume on Coinbase seemed to have a bigger increase than on Binance for a few hours.
Have a good Tuesday, everyone. Remember, tell a friend about Brave, and invest responsibly!
Brave and BAT Tutorials
Check out these basic tutorials about BAT and the Brave browser!
BAT's Official Telegram channel
Join us on the official BAT telegram! @BATProject
Current members: 14,340
Daily Discussion Rules
Remember, the permitted topics of discussion include, but are not limited to:
Oh hey, don't forget to upvote!
Disclaimer: All content on BAT Dailies are not affiliated with the official Brave or BAT team, and are solely run and provided by the BAT community unless otherwise stated. Market analysis and any (of my amateur) predictions are not financial advice!
submitted by dragespir to BATProject [link] [comments]

The Nuts and Bolts of Tether Cartel

I'm not sure this will be kept live, but FWIW if you really want to know more about tether, start here: https://archive.is/lk1lH
In that link you will find explanations to very "strange" things, including the fact that both Erik Vorhees and Roger Ver are defending Bitfinex and Tether (see URL in their names.)
In the link you find that RV invested in several companies that he has influence, such as Kraken, Binance and Bitfinex. The tether cartel is not a bitcoin cartel, it is a multi-altcoin cartel. It is a cycled pump and dump scam around a subset of coins pushed by key-people amidst it, notably: BCH, ETC, DASH, and some more.
Now, to have just a small glimpse of the sheer amount of manipulation going on, it is only funny that in rBTC (the sub that promotes BCH and bashes BTC daily selling the snake-oil "flippening") users have been in constant propaganda against Adam Back and others for talking about Tether. But, "strangely", they up vote RV to heavens even when he clearly defends Tether and invested in the companies behind it. Double standards at its best.
Please don't trust me, I beg you, simply go and read the archived links.
submitted by TastyRatio to CryptoCurrency [link] [comments]

What coin is your "sleeper" coin that has a promising future?

Thank you all for sharing! A summary of results and findings to be posted here within 24 hours!
Update 9/2/17 (Not organized):
Mentions:
2 Tierion, 7 Vertcoin, 2 Pied Piper, 9 ARK, Binance Coin, 2 LoMoCoin, OMG, 17 District0x, 7 Monero, 8 IOTA, DeepOnion, 5 Agrello, 10 Factom, 1 Metal, *3 Nexus, NoLimitCoin (NLC2), Ember, 4 signatum, 4 Funfair, 3 Rise, groestlcoin (grs), bitquark, 2 bitquence (BQX), bitsend, 5 nav, datum, 2 0x exchange (zrx), 3 BAT, 2 Peercoin, 1 bytom, sys coin, 2 sia, 1 stox, 2 tenx, 2 decred, 3 ripple XRP, oxycoin, 4 OMG, 2 IOC, 3 ASCH, Oxycoin, 2 Lisk, 3 *Zcoin, 2 BLOCKNET, komodo, 2 pivx, game, mgo, linx, viacoin, xspec, qrl, voise, *bitbean, bitbay, 3 ubiq, 3 iconomi, 2 taas, bet, shift, crown, *singulardtv (sngls), myst, maidsafe, synereo, particl, 2 *cat, nem, lykke, *adex (adx), 2 verge (xvg), *raiblocks (XRB), suncontract (SNC), *diamond (DMD), mooncoin, *cloak, walton (WTC), counterparty (XCP), sickcoin, MEMETIC, wild beast block (WBB), civic, ponzi, biblepay, gene-chain, aragon, gulden, byteball, patientory, 2 stellar lumens (XLM), qtum, EOS, WBC, 23 skidoo, stealthcoin, digibyte, coss ico, dobbscoin, opus (OPT)
Tierion: FCT competitor Vertcoin: lightning network & Atomic swaps, longterm mining drama solution via asic resistance useful 3-5 years from now, ltc fork. "If I understood LN + atomic swaps correctly, I can see BTC users atomic swapping to the ridiculously cheap VTC chain to transfer their coins to the intended party, then that party swaps back to BTC later. I mean, this is what I would do if the fees made sense. While this might take away some utility from LTC, few people know about VTC, and the total of both coins (2 x 84 million) will never be enough for the world if you take future growth and adoption into consideration." - corpski Pied Piper: those guys fuck ark: easy way to build blockchain apps, no good marketing yet, so will be big after that Binance Coin: Binanc exchange's coin LomoCoin: Chinese pokemon go geocaching app with new v2.0 coming out OMG: Best way to spend your crypto, will be around despite success of any crypto *Agrello: Legal stuff Factom: Adopted and funded by bill gates, DHS, used in the real world, few other competitors with this much current use. probably slow but steady growth though with better utilization of blockchains. Metal: consistenly doubled ~every month, new signatum: "About to get PoS, a roadmap that is being quickly ticked through and constant development. Dedicated and fair. It's a literal steal right now and once people realise staking will just make money for them, the more holders and the less sellers, unlike now with many miners selling. It's reliable and honest, a fresh reality in the ICO scam filled marketplace. " -skeetskeet172 Nexus: "former spacex founders launching cube-sats around the world to decentralize the dectranlization" -Raynre + soon to boom after conference ~mid september Rise: lisk copy warnings district: "once the masses adopt and wrap their heads around the idea of ethereum and other app based platforms, they'll need a way to implement into real world applications. E-commerce, social platforms, blogs that pay directly for views, etc. DNT is paving a way for everyone (without programming knowledge) to take part in the decentralization world. In my opinion this is huge for the long run." - sdot123 *Bitquence: bring investments to the masses Nav: Polymorph and staking, risky but ambitious 61,000,000 limited supply, ~flavor of month in december. zrx: can't find a good reason why this decentralized exchange will succeed and purpose of the token? BAT: founder of javascript despite the sour ICO Peercoin: long long history of failures and innovation but not giving up bytom syscoin: merge mining with bitcoin tenx: omg partnership, few credit cards, backed by vitalik decred: open structure, governance, only vote for a hard fork ripple: $5+ trillion transferred using SWIFT, $50 mil FEDWIRE, 1.5 bil on CHIPS ASCH: any coding language side chain creation, very active big team, pending big exchange approval bitbean: due for name change soon, staking, funny/moniker name (bean) zcoin: better than zcash/monero once roadmap is done: better POW, incentivizd nodes, trustless setup, permanent anonymous addresses, faster times, currently only $35mil market cap, used bitcoin code, asic resistant bitbay: valued <5x sys coin competitor, novel rolling peg, pos, dedicated underdog dev who was screwed over by his own team shift: decentralize the web crown: digital commodities, and more, neither POS or POW but ATOMIC in 1 month CAT: Creating ethereum smart contracts visually raiblocks: is like IOTA, close to coming to bittrex, 0 transaction fees suncontract: buyign and selling electricity. Will eb used for solar market.. Really good cause! mooncoin: in one year cloak: closed source, said to be better than monero/dash when goes open source *walton: NEW, chinese site but patents and samsung vp on board, patents for integration of iot and rfid and blockchain, only one binance right now and will balloon afterwards, https://twitter.com/Waltonchain counterparty: extends bitcoin to create assets *MEME: blockchain secured images. but how do they afford image hosting costs? wild beast block PonziCoin: definitely not a ponzi scheme of sorts... biblepay: religion ftw gene chain: sleepiest sleeper of sleepers. a very very specific sue case in bioinformatics, made first node sale to a genomics lab and about to publish a paper soon. gulden: send money but every new user causes gulden value to go up. can buy with cash on website right now. ubiq: said to be throttled by bittrex/killed. *OPUS: NEW
submitted by mannanj to CryptoCurrency [link] [comments]

NYC Meetup - Full Summary!

Following up on my other post which shared only a few high level points I thought people would be interested in, here's a more in-depth summary of the meetup. THIS IS VERY LONG! I don't really have a TL;DR beyond my other short highlight thread, but I think there are some other high level summaries. This is for those who want a very thorough recap of what was discussed. I'm happy to update this with anything shared in the comments which I remember and think is additive to the summary, definitely didn't catch every single thing.
I'm leaving out a few talking points/questions that either 1) I didn't totally catch, 2) provided no incremental information or 3) were just bad questions (there were some).
Sunny's Speech
Sunny began with a history of blockchain, from the bitcoin whitepaper to the first few alt coins to the advent of Ethereum. He then went on to discuss the extent to which these various stages involved meaningful/useful innovation: original alt coins did not, ethereum of course did, but is heavily flawed for enterprise use. He then went on to discuss what those primary flaws are and how VeChain is trying to solve them (scalability, governance, cost, etc.) He noted that technology is not blockchain's biggest obstacle, it's adoption. He talked about how, although some people will tell him to "get lost or something" he doesn't really believe in full decentralization. I think his point was that although it's nice in theory, it just isn't really practical, and it's a bad approach in particular for trying to get this new blockchain technology adopted in the mainstream. This goes back to something he said in another interview at some point - you can't just come in with totally new, radical technology outside the existing framework and replace everything that exists from the outside. You have to start within the existing framework, show people what's possible, and then change the system from the inside out.
He went on to discuss what he sees as problems with some of the existing projects. Talked about how projects in the top 20 have ecosystems worth 2 billion dollars, hold hundreds of millions of dollars worth of their own tokens to be used for the project's development etc., but they don't have a CFO. He thinks that should concern people.
I don't remember exactly where it fit in the narrative, but he discussed valuation/speculation. He pointed out that they have a number of their university research partners trying to work out token valuation models. He made a general point that more utility should equal more value, the implication being VeChain will have more real utility (and should therefore have more value) than any other blockchain. They had a slide showing some calculations and pointed out that if you look at the known metrics, the dividends, etc., the price of Google's stock is 85.7% speculation. Only $161 of it's $1,128 value (at the time they ran these numbers) can be tied to the current value. For Tencent, it's 93.5% speculation. He jokingly pointed out that in crypto it's about 99.99%, but I think one of the unspoken points here is that it's silly to think that on mainnet launch speculation about the future value is going to go away and you'll just have token value based on current Thor production. That isn't how markets or valuation work.
He then basically mocked people complaining about the code not yet being open source, and there being no whitepaper - the people who think these are red flags and that the project might be a 'scam'. As if PwC and DNV GL didn't do extensive diligence.
On this point, I'll quote GarzyWarzy from another thread:
"Sunny mentioned that the crypto community as a whole doesn’t seem to appreciate the level of reputational risk that these multi billion dollar enterprise partners take by publicly backing a blockchain startup (“what do people think would happen if PwC backed us and we failed in 6 months?”). As an investment banker who deals extensively with corporate governance issues and every type of business risk imaginable, I will add my two cents that this risk is massive and that is it a clear sign of extensive diligence and extreme trust in the VeChain team to execute their business plan for developing their ecosystem. Always remember, “it takes many years to build a reputation, and seconds to ruin it”."
I'm a corporate lawyer and couldn't agree with this more. The people who think a whitepaper (which they likely wouldn't even understand) is more reassuring than the endorsement by DNV GL, PwC, Draper and Breyer (who would never, ever make such an investment without extensive due diligence) have no idea how things work in the corporate world. DNV GL and PwC are recommending VeChain to clients, and Draper and Breyer have made investments through their funds, where they have a fiduciary duty to the investors in those funds. The amount of diligence that occurs before taking those reputational and legal (negligence, breach of fiduciary duty, etc.) risks is truly exhaustive.
Back to adoption, Sunny went on to compare blockchain to TCP/IP, as he's done in the past. Most people use email every day, but do they care about TCP/IP? Of course not. Blockchain will be the protocol infrastructure for things people use every day, whether they know it or not.
At this point, continuing to talk about adoption and use cases, he mentioned that they signed a top 3 insurance company in China as a client, and he also mentioned a CRM use case that's in the works.
He said the whitepaper will be out in a few days, and will explain a lot of what they're doing/what they're trying to do, and what some of the use cases are. They are focused on developing as many practical use cases as possible - this is how you get adoption. Once the use cases are defined, you can start "developing killer dApps" in relation to them. I think this is, to some degree, a subtle shot at Ethereum - his point here being that developing lots of dApps on a platform doesn't really mean much unless those dApps actually relate to a practical, defined real world use cases which ensures they will be used and adopted.
The whitepaper took so long because, in Sunny's words, his "english sucks" and after he wrote it, his teams needed to double, triple, and quadruple review/edit/refine what he wrote so that it is in professional english.
Back to adoption, he stated there are around 13/14 crypto projects they are working with who intend to use VeChain (either porting over from Ethereum or launching an ICO on the platform. More on this in the Q&A section). One of them is a company that already generates $50 million/month in revenue and want to 'blockchain-ize' their business. He pointed out here this is a company that isn't just interested in padding their coffers - they have money, that isn't an issue. These are the types of projects they like to work with. They aren't interested in being a 'shitcoin generator' (this was said by Sunny in the Q&A and got a laugh and round of applause). Last point on this, he noted that BitOcean is taking so long because the "Japanese government are being assholes". That's a direct quote. Sunny is hilarious. I can't overstate how likable he is - he comes off as a down to earth, cool, funny and easy going guy.
Kevin's Speech
Next, Kevin spoke. This was a short update on authority nodes and the mainnet. He mentioned that most projects have masternodes as basically a marketing tool, they aren't that meaningful or necessary. VeChain's authority masternodes are essential to the ecosystem. You can not become an authority node if you can not meaningfully contribute to growing the ecosystem. There is no room for negotiation on this. They aren't interested in having random people running validating authority nodes for profit and nothing else. As far as the application process, they received over 100 applications and are expecting more (authority node application and monitoring process will be ongoing to make sure VeChain has the best authority nodes possible and that each node is continuing to fulfill all of its obligations). As far as the applicant pool, they were about 71% enterprise, 29% individual. About 52% China, 23% America, then a mix of HK, Singapore, Japan, and others.
He then addressed the mainnet. Internal testing is done, they are now moving on to the public alpha testing, which is by invite only and is not the open source phase. This phase starts today and includes a number of professional firms auditing the code: PwC's cybersecurity team, secureware.io, Slow Mist, and Hosho. They will also be putting a bug bounty on Hacken eventually, finding a critical vulnerability could get you up to 2000 VEN tokens. This private testing will go on for a few weeks, before the public testing begins in early June which involves the code becoming open source - as of now, they expect it to start in the first week or two of June.
Then, he announced the 1 VEN to 100 VET token split. The example he gave was talking to friends about buying Bitcoin - some responded "it's already $8000, I can't buy a bitcoin I can't afford it". Kevin would respond, well actually you can buy .001 bitcoin if you want... and then they'd lose interest. I think what he's getting at is they want to be prepared for years down the road when demand is enormous - they don't want people dealing in fractions. Yes, I'm also sure they are aware of the implications for this in terms of price and the attractiveness of a 5 cent token verses a 5 dollar token. I don't deny that. Look at fucking Tron.
The Q&A Session
Someone asked about how the authority nodes will be monitored. Kevin explained there will be a dedicated team for this. They are serious about having the highest quality authority nodes and holding them to the standards they expect. There will be a quarterly review process, and any issues will be brought to the Steering Committee, which may decide to remove/replace an authority nodeholder if they aren't contributing and fulfilling their obligations. He noted that the whitepaper will include a thorough section on their governance model.
Question about it being difficult, currently, for companies (especially in the west) to find out how to contact them and work with them. What are VeChain's plans in terms of a business development team, marketing, etc. Sunny explained that while obviously they'll have an internal BD team, and this is being built out, they also want to heavily leverage the resources of the community. In a way, the community will be a giant business development team, and they will create standard toolkits for the community to use to market/introduce VeChain to people in the first instance. The guy then asked what if I got you Pfizer - that's enormous, what's my incentive? Sunny responded there will be rewards in VET tokens for bringing them clients.
I don't remember what the exact question was, but it was noted at this point that although the private, consortium chain is an Ethereum fork, the mainnet was built from scratch and is not an Ethereum fork. They did intentionally use the Ethereum Virtual Machine, though, so that Ethereum dApps can be easily ported over to VeChain. It sounds like they expect this to happen quite a bit. They also talked about how they went through the web3 libraries and 80% will be able to work directly with VeChain. They want interoperability, compatibility, and ultimately, an easy transition for Ethereum developers and dApps.
Someone asked about them building out their own IoT business or letting others do the IoT work. Sunny talked about how he believes IoT is the way to connect blockchain to the physical world. There was a story not worth sharing about why they initially acquired an IoT team, but he gave this example: when Apple first released the app store and the ability to develop, nobody knew how or used it. So, Apple built the apps themselves and basically showed everybody what was possible and how to do it by example. So too will VeChain take this approach. They are partnering with IoT manufacturers and developing some of their own IoT solutions, and they'll continue to do this, but the point isn't to dominate IoT. They are showing the world by example what can be done in terms of IoT on the VeChain platform, and they ultimately want people/enterprises to be able to create their own value and their own IoT solutions on the VeChain blockchain. Anyone who wants to do so will be able to.
Question about enterprises buying once the enterprise pool runs out - what happens if enterprises aren't comfortable doing what all of us have done (wiring money to a fiat gateway exchange, buying bitcoin/ethereum, moving it to binance, buying in the market, transferring out of binance, etc.). Kevin isn't really worried about this. They are talking to exchanges and service providers about it, they're talking to Circle about fiat pairing, etc., but realistically Kevin can see that exchanges are becoming more advanced and that ultimately they will be institutionalized in a way that basically just mitigates this concern.
Question about storage of VET tokens after mainnet. There will be a mobile wallet launch at the exact same time. This mobile wallet will 1) facilitate the token swap from VEN to VET (most people will probably do this on exchanges, but eventually you'll be able to do it in the mobile wallet if you missed doing it on an exchange), 2) have a module that shows you what kind of node you are, 3) automatically receive your generated Thor, and 4) eventually allow you to hold other ERC-20 tokens. They also mentioned that although they're talking to ledger, etc. they are developing their own hardware wallet. Kevin explained this is essential for enterprises serving as authority nodes or holding large amounts of VET. They aren't going online and ordering a ledger and setting it up. VeChain needs to be able to provide this service and assurance for them, and they will. This is why these guys are lightyears ahead in terms of enterprise adoption. They've thought about these things.
Question about 'competitors' like Waltonchain. First, Sunny goes "who?" and Kevin goes "what's Waltonchain?" But then Sunny went on by saying the "right" thing - there are no competitors in such a fledgling industry. He would love to hold hands with the other blockchain projects trying to do good things, and walk into the future together. He thinks projects can learn from each other and help each other. They aren't trying to crush competitors or beat anyone or anything like that. However, Sunny also jokingly asked "Seriously, why do people think Waltonchain is our competitor? We are what, 15th biggest project, and they are...?" He also went on to say that he is judging some competition or tech demo later this month on the 26th-28th, and that Waltonchain is the demo product. He thinks this is sort of funny, but also said if their product is great and the demo is good, there is no reason he wouldn't support them, vote for them, etc.
Question about Breyer and Draper relationships. Draper is invested in many cryptocurrency projects and many companies, has tons of connections, and he gives VeChain a way of talking to all of those projects/companies. Breyer was the one who set them up with the research team at a Chinese university, he was the link to Circle to discuss fiat onramps, etc. The connections these guys bring are tremendous. I should note here that in a small group conversation with Kevin during the networking portion after the speeches, which was initiated by GarzyWarzy (perhaps he can elaborate further), he confirmed that Breyer and Draper are both meaningfully invested in tokens, not just equity of the technology portion of the company.
Some clown actually used up time to ask "is CCK here?" Sunny said someone asked him this at Harvard also, and he was absolutely adamant that he doesn't know who this person is or how they are getting the information they have. He did not comment on it beyond that. He clearly thought it was a dumb question and said seriously that once and for all, he really doesn't know who it is.
Question about how many projects will be running on the mainnet day 1. Sunny said it's hard to say for sure, but that there are currently between 20 and 25 use cases deployed on the consortium chain, all of which will be moved over in the first few months. He also mentioned the 15ish crypto projects that will be moving over to or launching on the platform, and the fact that their client pipeline is now over 250. He transitioned a bit from this point to discuss how they "don't want to be a shitcoin generator". If you come to them with a project that is just an ICO with a whitepaper and no product, no proof of concept, etc., they're not going to want you to launch that. They would rather invest in you if they think you're a good project, help you develop those things, prove out what you're trying to do, then help you launch a serious ICO or dApp with a real use case. Again, they are all about practical use cases, this is the path to adoption. That said, the project will be open source ("you guys asked for open source, so") there will be some shitcoins, it's unavoidable.
I think that covers most of what I remember. Hope you all enjoy!
submitted by CryptopherWalken to Vechain [link] [comments]

Got scammed out of 1.15 Btc from 12xbit.com

I've been having difficult times lately and just started getting back into trading. I follow a lot of groups on telegram to keep up with crypto projects i deem are worth looking into. I'm putting my shit experience here so others don't fall for this scam, it seems my willingness to help others got the best of me.
On telegram i got a dm from someone with the pic of a cat and struck a casual conversation with me .. i asked him where he got my username .. he said he found me in a group. Then he asked me to help him withdraw his btc from a website (12xbit.com), as he cannot withdraw cause he got banned there. (Now i know this is a scam , i found out later after researching more). I made an account in there i didn't even have to enter my email, after which that telegram guy sent me the money to my account on that website. After which i tried to withdraw , but it said my funds are frozen and i'll have to deposit 250$ to verify my account. i stupidly sent the 250 $ , at which point i stepped inside the trap. Then after that even then my account said its frozen , i got an error because of my address it said. So i had to deposit 500 $ because my account was too big and the verification was not enough. The reason i went ahead a deposited another 500$ is because the site felt genuine and i thought i was helping someone who is new to crypto and made a stupid comment in the trollbox which got him banned on the site. I talked to customer support which talked to me in a very helpful way but it was all bullshit, making reasons and excuses as to why what i did didn't work. Then customer support gave me the telegram username of the admin of the site. I talked to him and he said i'm not being able to withdraw because the website only allows big amounts to be withdrawn when the withdrawal address holds 20 % to 30% of the amount to be withdrawn. I don't know why i believed him , at this point i just wanted to get my money back at the same time getting the amount out so i could give it back to the guy who first contacted me on telegram.

Cryptofor (the tech admin guy) said i can withdraw through the official extension of the website. So like an idiot i downloaded the extension, and i had to keep it open on a page where i had enough balance to be able to withdraw. I once kept it open on my binance page , during which time all my coins got sold to BTC and there was an attempt to withdraw all the coins to another address. I told cryptofor this and he said it was a "bug". I almost lost my shit because i got a withdrawal request email from binance which i hadn't initiated. After that he said to make an account on blockchain.com and try withdrawal from there. I had to put in 20% as he said , so i put in .5 btc from my binance account because it can't be withdrawn with my authentication first , or so i thought. After i realised what the extension was doing i uninstalled it and scanned for viruses, found nothing.

I went ahead a deposited .55 btc to my blockchain.com account that i had made (i had kept the extension open on my blockchain.com account for a while before uninstalling it), i had written down the backup key and 2fa on. But as soon as my bitcoins reached blockchain account , it automatically got sent to another address without my confirmation. Cryptofor said the bitcoins got sent to the website's system as i didn't send enough funds (80$ less than needed). I was puzzled how is it that even after uninstalling the extension and using a different browser altogether my blockchain account was still accessible to someone else. I took cryptofor's word for it , he said i'll get my funds back once the verification goes through. He appeared helpful , although now i know what really happened. Believing him that those btc are just frozen and will be recovered .. i sent .5 btc again to that blockchain.com account , this time i had set a second password so i'd need to put in a password to send btc. But again the moment i sent btc to it , it got sent elsewhere again. I still don't know how he managed to compromise a blockchain.com account in such a way that it was undetectable. I've been using crypto for years and never saw anything like it. Here's a screenshot https://prnt.sc/n4ozdw , the moment btc got into the account it got sent .. i couldn't do anything to stop this from happening. all in all i lost everything i had in my binance account trying to recover fake btc for someone who i didn't even know. The moment i had sent the second .5btc transaction i asked cryptofor what is going on and he said its in the system again, which now i know is complete bullshit. He sent me .35 btc to my account (i'm guessing he felt bad for how much he had scammed me out of), him giving me some btc back made me believe he's genuine, after that he deleted his telegram profile and just disappeared.
Overall i lost 1.15 Btc in total, I already was not doing well .. and this situation certainly didn't help. I kept in touch with cryptofor for three days trying to ask him if i can withdraw , this or that because i thought he was the website's tech manager. Now i know i got scammed , its a shame i got caught in it. If nothing else , others can read my stupid story and avoid such scams. Have a good day , i know i won't for a while .. i'm just heartbroken.

P.S after this happened , i got DM from two other people claiming they needed my help in withdrawing funds from websites they got banned in.
Its funny how I'm getting negative reception on this , I have nothing to gain from putting this experience here other than help others know what to avoid, but please go ahead and tell me how wrong I am that'll help solve everything.
As it so happens 12xbit is denying taking any responsibility and the cryptofor dude's (Aaron) website is cryptofor.org, it has that extension which can remotely access your account and take out crypto.
submitted by CryptoWarrior0203 to CryptoCurrency [link] [comments]

Subreddit Stats: cryptocurrencymemes top posts from 2018-12-31 to 2019-12-30 21:54 PDT

Period: 364.37 days
Submissions Comments
Total 1000 3412
Rate (per day) 2.74 9.34
Unique Redditors 354 1081
Combined Score 35766 8616

Top Submitters' Top Submissions

  1. 6640 points, 167 submissions: jaggedsoft
    1. relatable (207 points, 11 comments)
    2. I like guys who take big risks 😨 (137 points, 7 comments)
    3. Altseason (129 points, 8 comments)
    4. Shoulda took the money (124 points, 6 comments)
    5. Time travel ⌛ (122 points, 14 comments)
    6. i read the whitepaper 📰 (118 points, 5 comments)
    7. You never know what someone is going through (110 points, 10 comments)
    8. next alt season 🦖💥 (108 points, 7 comments)
    9. Wake up call 📞😱🔊 (106 points, 1 comment)
    10. Now that's what I'm talking about 😇 (103 points, 4 comments)
  2. 2877 points, 104 submissions: definitelynotdeleted
    1. I bought bitcoin for 20,000 and sold for $ 3000 (114 points, 5 comments)
    2. 18+ (89 points, 7 comments)
    3. Binance lottery ))) (83 points, 15 comments)
    4. BTC Dominance: 62.0% (71 points, 3 comments)
    5. BTC Dominance: 65.3% (65 points, 6 comments)
    6. Keanu won’t give you bad advice😉 (62 points, 4 comments)
    7. BTC Dominance: 69.2% (60 points, 3 comments)
    8. BTC Dominance: 70.1% (59 points, 15 comments)
    9. Bitcoin 11000$ (59 points, 2 comments)
    10. My deposit... (55 points, 4 comments)
  3. 983 points, 16 submissions: Frix13
    1. How DARE you :D (128 points, 12 comments)
    2. Nothing can scare us anymore! 💪 😎 (121 points, 8 comments)
    3. How I imagine most of us 😅 👊 (110 points, 9 comments)
    4. Do you have the same problem? 😅 💸 🚀 (107 points, 8 comments)
    5. Just HODL guys!!! 😆 (96 points, 14 comments)
    6. Every Crypto Facebook group right now :D (85 points, 2 comments)
    7. When Moon??? 🚀 (75 points, 6 comments)
    8. Im certainly not in it for the profits, that's for sure :'D (58 points, 10 comments)
    9. What is this "profits" you speak of?! 📈 (54 points, 4 comments)
    10. Don't miss the train, Bull-market here we come!!! 😂 (45 points, 3 comments)
  4. 922 points, 23 submissions: hodlorcrypt
    1. Disgusting (95 points, 65 comments)
    2. You have been visited by the nice duck (94 points, 66 comments)
    3. Point Break: Crypto Edition (83 points, 0 comments)
    4. My alts' sats whenever BTC spikes (77 points, 7 comments)
    5. Sweet, sweet airdrops (75 points, 0 comments)
    6. Shots fired (60 points, 11 comments)
    7. Trying to laugh away the pain (54 points, 2 comments)
    8. Lookin' for some lovin' (50 points, 3 comments)
    9. Marilyn Cryptoe (50 points, 4 comments)
    10. Me rollin' up to alt season (50 points, 8 comments)
  5. 746 points, 31 submissions: cryptoparody
    1. Current mood in crypto (77 points, 2 comments)
    2. Binance to block US 🇺🇸 users! (75 points, 10 comments)
    3. When Bitcoin went over $9k 💪 (54 points, 8 comments)
    4. Who wants to be a millionaire? (49 points, 7 comments)
    5. Crypto pump and dumps 🤑😵 (45 points, 3 comments)
    6. How we all feeling? (43 points, 6 comments)
    7. Throwback Thursday to 2017 💸😱 (32 points, 0 comments)
    8. The struggle is real in crypto (29 points, 6 comments)
    9. Tough road ahead for Libra 🤣 (29 points, 6 comments)
    10. They hate what they can’t control. Top 10 banks got fined a combined $174 billion for violations — dwarfing the MC of Bitcoin (27 points, 1 comment)
  6. 726 points, 21 submissions: cooriah
    1. Get out of fiat. (72 points, 2 comments)
    2. Told ya so. (72 points, 24 comments)
    3. Current financial situation (62 points, 8 comments)
    4. When someone asks for financial advice and you tell them about Bitcoin. (60 points, 4 comments)
    5. There will always be new people coming in with questions. (50 points, 16 comments)
    6. Feeling every dip after buying at the last peak. (47 points, 2 comments)
    7. Oh, it's such sweet trolling to say it back at the same smug, fiat statists. (43 points, 4 comments)
    8. If I had $267,000,000, I'd keep it on the blockchain. I would not trust any fiat bank to hold it for me. (40 points, 16 comments)
    9. Saying crypto is too slow and difficult for mass adoption is just like when they said nobody will carry a "cinder block" mobile phone around everywhere, and with that low battery capacity. (38 points, 6 comments)
    10. ♪Thats the way, a-huh a-huh, I like it, a-huh a-huh. ♫ (38 points, 3 comments)
  7. 701 points, 11 submissions: resonantseed
    1. No pain, time for gains (128 points, 8 comments)
    2. Getting help as crypto noob (106 points, 17 comments)
    3. Alts today (100 points, 11 comments)
    4. EOS birth of an ecosystem (77 points, 4 comments)
    5. Being at party with no crypto people (74 points, 9 comments)
    6. Thy holiness giveth and taketh (51 points, 2 comments)
    7. Asking shills legitimate questions (44 points, 1 comment)
    8. How it feels every time I get more crypto (41 points, 1 comment)
    9. Clutch your coins tight (34 points, 5 comments)
    10. Holding heavy alt bags (24 points, 1 comment)
  8. 654 points, 12 submissions: minecoins247365
    1. Dollar Cost Averaging into Crypto Right Now (190 points, 20 comments)
    2. How It Feels To Hold Altcoins Right Now (159 points, 18 comments)
    3. Altcoins Right Now... (70 points, 10 comments)
    4. my crypto bags right now (68 points, 6 comments)
    5. How the US Copyright Office Filed the #Faketoshi Application (52 points, 4 comments)
    6. Countdown to Altcoin Season Like... (42 points, 11 comments)
    7. Every time Craig Wright claims to be Satoshi Nakamoto (21 points, 2 comments)
    8. TFW buying $BCHABC $BCHSV $BTG (14 points, 0 comments)
    9. When Google Knows You're Drunk And Want Bitcoin (12 points, 0 comments)
    10. ...Then You Win (11 points, 1 comment)
  9. 593 points, 15 submissions: nathanielx9
    1. Found this yesterday and thought this was funny (102 points, 5 comments)
    2. Happy Valentines Day Everyone (84 points, 4 comments)
    3. Here we go again... (73 points, 5 comments)
    4. When you decide to start day trading in a bear market (70 points, 3 comments)
    5. All I want is Ramen :/ (46 points, 2 comments)
    6. Time to reuse our 2017 memes? (40 points, 2 comments)
    7. Oof (39 points, 2 comments)
    8. Shitcoin communities be like (36 points, 3 comments)
    9. Too soon? (25 points, 5 comments)
    10. Take money from banks. Deploy the fud. Take all back (21 points, 0 comments)
  10. 472 points, 17 submissions: RideYourChart
    1. Whales (68 points, 4 comments)
    2. “Fear Of Missing Out” (67 points, 6 comments)
    3. You here also because of "technology"? (65 points, 3 comments)
    4. Paid Groups (55 points, 2 comments)
    5. "it's just correction, bro" (50 points, 2 comments)
    6. Bottom again (44 points, 3 comments)
    7. This time will be x100 for sure (18 points, 0 comments)
    8. Bitcoin in last hours: (16 points, 1 comment)
    9. Initial Exchange Offering (IEO) (16 points, 0 comments)
    10. Stop Loss (13 points, 4 comments)

Top Commenters

  1. jaggedsoft (569 points, 194 comments)
  2. Thefriendlyfaceplant (161 points, 37 comments)
  3. MD5HashBrowns (118 points, 36 comments)
  4. cryptoparody (108 points, 38 comments)
  5. parakite (83 points, 37 comments)
  6. snoop_Odin (83 points, 25 comments)
  7. nathanielx9 (81 points, 29 comments)
  8. NOWPayments (74 points, 34 comments)
  9. coinminingrig (71 points, 24 comments)
  10. ChangeNow_io (70 points, 32 comments)

Top Submissions

  1. relatable by jaggedsoft (207 points, 11 comments)
  2. Dollar Cost Averaging into Crypto Right Now by minecoins247365 (190 points, 20 comments)
  3. When you buy Bitcoin at 19K by rewardstoken (181 points, 23 comments)
  4. How It Feels To Hold Altcoins Right Now by minecoins247365 (159 points, 18 comments)
  5. You gotta believe me! by gabi9900 (155 points, 8 comments)
  6. I’ve seen some shit by ZipZapBeepBoop (154 points, 10 comments)
  7. Yup. by diegojoke88 (151 points, 15 comments)
  8. I think this meme deserved a repost by NinjaDK (145 points, 7 comments)
  9. USD vs Bitcoin by coinvvolf (139 points, 9 comments)
  10. I like guys who take big risks 😨 by jaggedsoft (137 points, 7 comments)

Top Comments

  1. 31 points: T1Pimp's comment in Time travel ⌛
  2. 28 points: Iron0ne's comment in Stock trader vs crypto HODLer
  3. 24 points: yeahnoworriesmate's comment in You have been visited by the nice duck
  4. 23 points: Pr1max91's comment in Shoulda took the money
  5. 21 points: Gforcetuga's comment in Member when ____ happened in crypto? (fill in the gap)
  6. 19 points: I_Like_Tech_Drawings's comment in Dollar Cost Averaging into Crypto Right Now
  7. 18 points: Skoopitup's comment in Dollar Cost Averaging into Crypto Right Now
  8. 18 points: Thefriendlyfaceplant's comment in Yup.
  9. 18 points: kokomeows's comment in Me rollin' up to alt season
  10. 17 points: Citizen52's comment in relatable
Generated with BBoe's Subreddit Stats
submitted by subreddit_stats to subreddit_stats [link] [comments]

CZ Crypto Deepfake is Funny Now, But it May Not be So Amusing Soon

CZ Crypto Deepfake is Funny Now, But it May Not be So Amusing Soon
A deepfake of crypto trading master CZ is out, entertaining the Cryptoverse. But deepfakes, entering this industry may not be so funny in the near future.
https://preview.redd.it/cm58ci60e3x31.jpg?width=692&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8fedc326046c1856008a184441b5a665994e20fb
In a deepfake video, published today, we see the CEO of major cryptocurrency exchange Binance, Changpeng Zhao (CZ), and his followers celebrating Bitcoin (BTC) mooning in the Binance Trading Lab, while the fiat banker looks on. The celebration is followed by CZ’s crypto trading advice. And all of this is set in a classic Chinese Kung Fu movie, or to be more precise – CZ’s face is set in a movie. The clip ends with a disclaimer saying that the deepfake is created to raise awareness about synthetic or AI-generated media, by Alethea, which is building AI-powered decentralized applications (dapps) aimed at helping users identify deepfakes and not be manipulated by their content.
And this is also our point here. While a particular deepfake may be amusing, it’s not difficult to imagine people using this technology for a more nefarious purpose. What is a deepfake? Shortly and simply, it’s an AI-based face-swap. This deep learning technology can be used to create or alter video content so that it presents, in a disturbingly convincing manner, something that never happened. It has been used since two years ago to edit the faces of celebrities onto actors in pornographic videos, and since then a number of clips have been produced of famous people saying or doing something which never occurred. Here is another example:
Now let’s turn to crypto specifically, and take two real recent examples that affected the market. With fake news circulating that police raided the Beijing Tron offices, TRX price fell 5%. China’s President Xi Jinping urged the country to accelerate the development of blockchain technology, after which – whether due to his words or not – BTC exploded, altcoins rallied, and six China-based coins saw a particularly large rise. These are just two of many examples that prove that the words and actions by a single person or organization can move the market significantly.
Now, imagine a person – one with a liking for criminal activities – holding some TRX, let’s say, and they want to earn more money than it’s (legally) possible at that given time. They produce a video of "Justin Sun" saying that Tron just made a multi-billion partnership with Microsoft, Apple, JP Morgan and McDonald's at the same time. (Or it could be "Charlie Lee", saying the same about Litecoin (LTC)). Imagine this person wanting to push the price of TRX up super quickly, but also bring Binance Coin (BNB) down at the same time for whatever reason, so a video with CZ saying Binance is under attack comes out, and millions in funds have been lost, personal data stolen, the whole catastrophic mess. This person may buy TRX or LTC for USD 100,000 and sell it for USD 200,000 in the short time somebody needs to figure out the video is a deepfake. At that point, the pump and dump deed is done and there’s nothing anybody can do about it.
Moreover, we already have myriad of Twitter scammers that stole millions from crypto owners without any AI, just by editing a few pictures and creating fake Twitter accounts. It wouldn't be a surprise if one day 'Master CZ' releases a video and asks to send him 1 BTC so he could send back two.
submitted by CryptoHamstereu to u/CryptoHamstereu [link] [comments]

CZ Crypto Deepfake is Funny Now, But it May Not be So Amusing Soon

CZ Crypto Deepfake is Funny Now, But it May Not be So Amusing Soon

https://preview.redd.it/0rad2xdzwpv31.jpg?width=720&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=29c768036192a91d7e8d990be6de40e8cc050b65
A deepfake of crypto trading master CZ is out, entertaining the Cryptoverse. But deepfakes, entering this industry may not be so funny in the near future.
In a deepfake video, published today, we see the CEO of major cryptocurrency exchange Binance, Changpeng Zhao (CZ), and his followers celebrating Bitcoin (BTC) mooning in the Binance Trading Lab, while the fiat banker looks on. The celebration is followed by CZ’s crypto trading advice. And all of this is set in a classic Chinese Kung Fu movie, or to be more precise – CZ’s face is set in a movie. The clip ends with a disclaimer saying that the deepfake is created to raise awareness about synthetic or AI-generated media, by Alethea, which is building AI-powered decentralized applications (dapps) aimed at helping users identify deepfakes and not be manipulated by their content.

https://reddit.com/link/dpagj3/video/ocpo2szfxpv31/player
And this is also our point here. While a particular deepfake may be amusing, it’s not difficult to imagine people using this technology for a more nefarious purpose. What is a deepfake? Shortly and simply, it’s an AI-based face-swap. This deep learning technology can be used to create or alter video content so that it presents, in a disturbingly convincing manner, something that never happened. It has been used since two years ago to edit the faces of celebrities onto actors in pornographic videos, and since then a number of clips have been produced of famous people saying or doing something which never occurred. Here is another example:
https://youtu.be/cQ54GDm1eL0
Now let’s turn to crypto specifically, and take two real recent examples that affected the market. With fake news circulating that police raided the Beijing Tron offices, TRX price fell 5%. China’s President Xi Jinping urged the country to accelerate the development of blockchain technology, after which – whether due to his words or not – BTC exploded, altcoins rallied, and six China-based coins saw a particularly large rise. These are just two of many examples that prove that the words and actions by a single person or organization can move the market significantly.
Now, imagine a person – one with a liking for criminal activities – holding some TRX, let’s say, and they want to earn more money than it’s (legally) possible at that given time. They produce a video of "Justin Sun" saying that Tron just made a multi-billion partnership with Microsoft, Apple, JP Morgan and McDonald's at the same time. (Or it could be "Charlie Lee", saying the same about Litecoin (LTC)). Imagine this person wanting to push the price of TRX up super quickly, but also bring Binance Coib (BNB) down at the same time for whatever reason, so a video with CZ saying Binance is under attack comes out, and millions in funds have been lost, personal data stolen, the whole catastrophic mess. This person may buy TRX or LTC for USD 100,000 and sell it for USD 200,000 in the short time somebody needs to figure out the video is a deepfake. At that point, the pump and dump deed is done and there’s nothing anybody can do about it.
Moreover, we already have myriad of Twitter scammers that stole millions from crypto owners without any AI, just by editing a few pictures and creating fake Twitter accounts. It wouldn't be a surprise if one day 'Master CZ' releases a video and asks to send him 1 BTC so he could send back two.
Not so funny anymore, right?
submitted by ionskurtu to u/ionskurtu [link] [comments]

Consensus Network EP36: Buy, Borrow and Die: Bitcoin Style

Catch the full episode: https://www.consensusnetwork.io/podcastepisodes/2019/10/5/ep36-buy-borrow-and-die-bitcoin-style-1
Buck: Welcome back to the show everyone. Today my guest on Wealth Formula Podcast is Zack Prince. He's Founder and CEO of BlockFi. BlockFi bridges the gap between blockchain and the basic financial products that you're used to including interest-bearing accounts and loans. Zack, welcome to Wealth Formula Podcast. I think you we might have had you on before as a Consensus Network replay but first time on Wealth Formula Podcast specifically, so welcome.
Zac: Yeah, excited to be here, Buck. Thanks for having me. And it's good to chat with you again
Buck: Yeah so remind me how you got into this you know Bitcoin stuff in the first place, I mean you were as I understand you were a traditional finance guy right so where did the blockchain part come in?
Zac: Sure so I was I was working at a company in the FinTech world that provided data and technology solutions to institutional investors that wanted to participate in some of the new online lending platforms, whether they were real estate platforms or consumer lending platforms, and I kind of became the FinTech guy amongst my friend group and people would ask me you know should I invest in these real estate deals on fund rise or buy loans from Lending Club and I started writing a blog to share the information more efficiently with my friends basically and I started expanding a little bit writing about Robo advisory and some other things that were going on in the FinTech space and that's what led me to Bitcoin, and this is back in early 2015. I didn't start BlockFi until 2017 because I started following the market in the background, still working in traditional financial services in FinTech and then in early 2017 it started to feel like mainstream adoption was starting to happen in the crypto ecosystem. I'm started going to some meetups in New York City because at a certain point my wife said Zac, you're talking about crypto all the time and you're talking to me about it and I don't want to talk about it so you should find some other people to talk about this with. And the meetup composition started to change and in 2016 when I started going to these meetups it was the early crypto adopters you know libertarians, computer scientists and then in early 2017 I started to see some venture capitalists, some guys who had just left their job at Wall Street still wearing a suit, some more entrepreneurs and it was a really exciting time in the ecosystem, things like the Enterprise Ethereum Alliance were getting announced which had participation microsoft and a lot of other you know fortune 500 companies and I had started to believe in it. I was drinking the kool-aid a little bit so I decided to find a way to get involved in the space full-time and that's what led me to start BlockFi.
Buck: So I have to imagine that the response you got from the traditional finance people around that time when you started talking about the blockchain space and when you started being more and more involved with that was probably not a very positive response initially or did you did you experience some of that sort of you know rejection initially to what you were doing?
Zac: Yeah absolutely. But you know throughout my career this is now kind of the third emerging technology industry that I've worked in. I was originally an advertising technology starting like you know 15 years ago and I was in FinTech specifically the online lending side of FinTech which in its early days was called peer-to-peer lending and now in crypto. So having to do a lot of education explain it you know why something isn't crazy and it might work and here's why and here's the value proposition and here's what it is, I've gotten very used to that and comfortable with it. But yeah there were a lot of people who are like you know I've heard Bitcoin is only used by drug dealers and money launderers. I've heard that I'm supposed to care about blockchain and not Bitcoin. And you know at BlockFi we’re providing financial products into the market so it's a heavily regulated business so we also had to communicate with regulators. We had to explain to state regulators, federal regulators why what we were doing with Bitcoin and other cryptos than when you're doing these same types of things with assets that they're more familiar with.
Buck: So when you were talking to people back in, I don't know I guess 2016/17 and it's not a long time ago, it's only two years ago, but I have to imagine that the response or the you know the approach that people take to you when you speak to investors is very different. Has it become more mainstream in that regard for you know for big money investors?
Zac: It's absolutely become more mainstream you know the end of 2017 Q3/Q4. Point was going on that parabolic run it started to get covered everywhere, I mean it was on CNBC every day it was in Bloomberg New York Times Wall Street Journal. If you were paying attention to the financial industry and markets you heard about Bitcoin at that time if you hadn't heard about it before. So from a baseline of awareness perspective it got a lot better and then in 2018 you had a number of positive developments for the sector including one that I think is probably the most noteworthy which is that Bitcoin futures were listed on the CME the institutional investor perspective that's massive. You now have a well regulated well known super trustworthy venue where you can get exposure to this asset class, you also had companies like Grayscale bringing products to the market which are accessible to certain types of investors and their low bridge accounts and you started to see some adoption from companies like FinTech companies like Robin Hood and Square making Bitcoin available on their platforms. So the conversation has absolutely changed a lot and it's become less about whether or not this is something that's going to continue to exist whether or not it's something that was just a bubble and is going to die and now it's more about ok how is it going to get used how big could it get what are the interesting applications of it and what could have potentially disrupt in the traditional financial ecosystem.
Buck: So you know we had obviously following this you know pop in 2017, you know I actually like you kind of really got into this early 2017 so timing was pretty good I guess now regards. Good or bad depending how you look at it but I was there before before the parabolic move. And then we have you know then we followed this up with a crypto winter and and you know who knows if we're done with it, I guess we certainly are much better off than we were. You know a unit buddy it's funny Zac I don’t know if you remember this but I was about to, we'll talk about BlockFi specifically in a minute but, I was about to use BlockFi for borrowing because I like this idea of borrowing you know collateralized debt and collateralized debt on assets and buying something else. So I was about to do it and then Bitcoin lost a clip and I was like literally and I remember I was just emailing with somebody somebody over there and I was like sorry dude I guess I just sold it, I just sold all that Bitcoin I had and you sent one email back to me and it said “capitulation” but it you know and so now we're looking back at these we go down from 3,000 back up you know been sort of flirting around this 10,000 and it seems like we're kind of maybe that we're stuck there, maybe we're kind of out of winter, maybe we're in a holding pattern but it seems like to me that since that two years not only is the awareness increase but the development of the ecosystem itself is so much further advanced than it was in 2017. Is this an unusual case where the technology and maybe even the infrastructure is actually outpacing the price?
Zac: You know it's really hard to say. I would argue that in some ways it's typical. In other industries that showed a lot of promise where investors could you know participate maybe a little bit ahead of the adoption curve you saw crazy price run ups with the tech bubble and you know ‘99-2000 being the one that's kind of top of mind in recent memory and then on the other side of things, are we behind where the price should be now? It's really hard to say because this is kind of like a commodity type asset built on a payment network and valuing that is challenging and there's not a perfect model for for doing it today. It's not as easy as something that's cashflow producing but I'm incredibly bullish. I'm on record as saying at the beginning of this year that Bitcoin has only had one year in its 10-year existence where it had a lower low than the year before and parted this year around the low price for 2018 and I predicted that we would in the year had a higher price than where we started the year pretty soon and now we're up and you know around 300 percent from where we started the year. As that happens in investing is people frequently look at things on a year-to-year performance basis and when people are looking at Bitcoin even if all we do is stay around 10 K from here when they're looking at how Bitcoin performed rather than other relative to other assets at the end of 2019 it's probably going to look fantastic. And you also have an event coming up and in the summer of next year called The Halvening where basically the supply that's produced by miners is going to get cut in half and so if you believe in the stock the flow type models of valuation for Bitcoin that is usually a very big driver of price appreciation.
Buck: I believe May of 2020, right?
Zac: That's right.
Buck: In May of 2020. Can you just talked a little bit about that just so people know because people hear about it, I've been talking about it but I don't think that it really explained it.
Zac: Yeah and you know I'm not I'm not a computer scientist so I can explain it in a you know in a very simple…
Buck: No one else here is either.
Zac: So basically the way that new Bitcoin is created is through this process called mining. And it's analogous to mining gold except instead of finding a place in the earth where gold exists and then getting your trucks and mining equipment and digging it out of the ground, the way bitcoin is mined is using this computer program and there is now specialized computer hardware that's built specifically and optimized for mining Bitcoin. And you have this network of machines around the world where the input is energy into the mining hardware and the output is new Bitcoin and those miners are what provides the power for the payment network a Bitcoin to run and when we say that there is this event called The Halvening, what that basically means is that the output that's built into the Bitcoin program that the miners are receiving as their payment for contributing energy to the network, is going to get cut in half. So the miners are going to have the same you know relative input but the amount that they're receiving is going to get cut in half for that input. This should, if the demand side for Bitcoin remains equal, it should drive up the price and historically Bitcoin has had three of these Halvening events in its lifetime so far I believe and around each Halvening you have seen you know six months before or six months after a pretty material run up in price.
Buck: Yeah so it also goes along with that sort of that the entire idea that Bitcoin unlike you know other assets including gold is it's a deflationary asset ultimately and and that's one of the things that makes that happening really significant. Apart from and I have one more question before we get to block five which is apart from the Halvening, you know thing that's happening, what is maybe the biggest development or upcoming thing that's coming up that makes you the most bullish on the future of Bitcoin or blockchain in general?
Zac: Sure so I think I wouldn't actually point to any one specific thing, I would point to two broad trends. So one is institutional adoption and participation in the asset class and the other is better ramps for retail participation into the asset class and just focusing here you know on the US market because it really is an international story but just in the US market. In September we should have Bakkt launching their futures platform. Bakkt is owned by ICE, the Intercontinental Exchange, and there's a big core difference between their futures and the current futures that are available on the CME in that futures on Bakkt platform are going to be physically settled so that means that actual Bitcoin is going to be needed to facilitate the trading on Bakkt’s platform which does not happen on CMEs exchange so that's that should be a very positive catalyst in terms of demand for physical Bitcoin that could have an impact on the price. Also on the institutional side this year I believe earlier this year, the first pension fund made an investment into an asset management vehicle that was focused on investing in Bitcoin and private equity opportunities in the Bitcoin and blockchain sector. So that will be a trend.
Buck: Which pension fund was it?
Zac: It was in North Carolina so I think it was like the North Carolina Firefighters and the group that raised the money from them was Morgan Creek Digital it’s actually invested in BlockFi by Anthony Pompliano Twitter and Mark Yusko so that's on the institutional side. And then on the retail side you've seen FinTech companies like Square and Robin Hood offer Bitcoin trading to their users. But soon you will also have companies like TD Ameritrade E-Trade and others offer Bitcoin to their users sometimes be a partnership sometimes because they've built it directly. You also at some point might see progress made in terms of an ETF getting approved that would give retail investors in the US market exposure to Bitcoin in a really easy and familiar way. All of those things are tremendously positive catalysts and the caliber of people working on them only continues to increase. Talent was attracted into the sector very, very rapidly these days.
Buck: You know one question that leads me to is that all of this is happening with Bitcoin for the most part. Are alt coins in your opinion is that market coming back or is that something that we're gonna see probably select you know group of tokens projects emerge and then the rest will kind of just get left in the dust, what do you think?
Zac: I mean I'll tell you exactly what I'm doing with my portfolio and then I'll provide a bit more color. So my asset allocation in the crypto side of my investing is I'm like 90% Bitcoin 5% Ethereum and 5% B&B; which is the Binance right. So I'm super bullish on Bitcoin. I think that you know there's a chance that Ether makes a comeback specifically I think that a lot of the stable coins that have been launched have been built on Ethereum if you're not familiar with stable coins it's basically the concept of a dollar but on a blockchain which could be really really powerful because it creates the opportunity for the delivery of US dollar denominated financial services at a global scale not using the traditional banking rails. And then B&B; I mean Binance is the biggest and most successful exchange they have a history of innovating, creating new products, going fast and so I'm taking a bit of a flyer with them but I'm 90% Bitcoin. I don't think that I'm not bullish on any of the other all coins frankly I struggle to see you know the big upside I have heard whispers in the community that there's kind of like a new wave of altcoins 3.0 might emerge, you know could see some some good returns similar to what some of the ICOs did in 2017 but it's not an area of focus for me. So that's my view.
Buck: Yeah let's talk about BlockFi. Remind us exactly what BlockFi is.
Zac: Sure so we're a wealth management platform for crypto investors. Today we have two products that we offer. One product is analogous to a savings account from a traditional bank where you're able to earn interest on your holdings except on BlockFi, the assets instead of being dollars are bitcoin and Ether and we don't have FDIC insurance so it's not exactly the same risk profile as a savings account at a bank, but conceptually you're able to hold Bitcoin and an account with BlockFi and earn interest on it paid in Bitcoin every month. That's one product that we have. The second product that we have which you are alluding to earlier offers our clients the ability to borrow dollars secured by the value of their cryptocurrency and it's analogous to a securities backed loan or a liquidity access line in the traditional world except instead of securities we're taking Bitcoin or other digital assets as collateral and lending it rates as low as four point five lending USD that rates as low as four point five percent a year.
Buck: I wanna pick these apart a little bit if you don't mind. In terms of this savings account first of all is it just bitcoin or is it bitcoin, Ethereum?
Zac: We actually support three assets in the interest account currently Bitcoin, Ether and GUSD which is the stable coin from Gemini.
Buck: Got it. And talk about the interest because it's not one flat interest rate right it's different depending on how much cryptocurrency actually is held?
Zac: Correct so there's a tiered interest rate structure. Currently on Bitcoin for balances up to ten Bitcoin, we offer a six point two percent annual yield and for balances above ten Bitcoin it's a 2.2 percent annual yield. On Ether, for balances up to two hundred Ether it's a 3.3 percent annual yield and balances above two hundred Ether is 0.5% annual yield and for GUSD the stable coin it's an eight point six percent interest rate with no tier so yeah those are the different rates.
Buck: Why did, I mean was it just a matter of like an issue with people dumping like a thousand Bitcoin and trying to get six you know 6% of that, was it just too hard to you know make that a long-term part of the business model or why did the higher levels end up changing to a lower rate?
Zac: Sure so I wanted to function of market conditions and to it's a function of supply and demand. So we launched the interest account in March of this year. We were just starting to come out of the bear market and one of the things that happened as we switched from being in a bear market to being in a bull market is the futures switched from being in backwardation to contango which basically means that our institutional borrowers the groups that we lend to that enable us to pay the rate to depositors had less of a need they had less demand to borrow and they were willing to pay lower rates to borrow crypto than they were when we were building and planning to launch this product. The second thing that happened is we were surprised to the upside in terms of the level of interest that we received from depositors and especially depositors with very large sums of cryptocurrency. So to give you an example you know within a day or two of making the product available publicly, we had a number of groups that were depositing 5, 10, 15, 20 million dollars worth of Bitcoin and so the supply-demand that we have to manage is, the amount that we have on deposit relative to the size of this market that will borrow Bitcoin size of the market that will borrow Bitcoin is partially a function of market sentiments partially a function of number of trading venues and the liquidity profile and it's partially a function of you know BlockFi’s efforts in terms of sales and client development relationship management. So the supply side got a little bit ahead of the demand side on deposit and how much there was available to borrow so we made a few tweaks. We want to keep the 6%, 6.2% rate on Bitcoin available to as many people as possible for as long as possible so that's why we went with the tiered structure where we made it available on balances up to 10 and reduced it for balances above that.
Buck: Got it and the interest on that, when you say 6.2 percent that six point like it's all denominated in Bitcoin, you're not paying cash out right?
Zac: Correct so to use round numbers to provide an easy example you start on January first with a hundred Bitcoin in an account, by the subsequent January first you will have 106 point 2 Bitcoin in your account.
Buck: Yeah and that that's kind of neat too because then you're you know you're also getting potentially the upside of that you know I mean they made 6% but if you if you're really bullish on the market you could be potentially looking at a lot more than 6% on your money. How about in terms of the, is there like a you know do you do it sort of a month-to-month or six month or month you know year-long contracts for these things?
Zac: It's month-to-month. So the rates are subject to change on a monthly basis. We provide notifications at least a week in advance before the end of one month on what the rates will be for the subsequent month and people are able to you know withdraw any time without penalty. We reserve up to 7 days to process withdrawals but we've never taken more than one business day to process a withdrawal so they're pretty quick but not instant for security reasons and yeah it's pretty flexible.
Buck: How about the lump in the lending side how does how does that work? So now I've got like 10 Bitcoin and so I would deposit that I guess and you guys I understand that maybe that that goes into like a Gemini account or something, is that still how it works?
Zac: Correct so we have a partnership with Gemini for custody. So when you log into a BlockFi account you'll have a deposit address. When you send Bitcoin to that deposit address it actually goes directly into storage with Gemini. Gemini was the first custodian in the crypto sector to receive insurance against cyber hacks on their platform. They were also the first custodian to get to complete a SOC 2 compliance audit and they have a really long track record of custody billions of dollars worth of crypto without ever having any issues. So it goes directly to Gemini and then you're able to interact with block-wise platform to take any actions that you might deem necessary. So you can view your interest payments you can withdraw you can deposit more you can also take out a loan. So in terms of taking out a loan, if you have ten Bitcoin that's worth roughly a hundred thousand US dollars at this point in time, you can borrow up to fifty percent of that value in a US dollar loan which can be funded be a wire or stable coin and then the structure of those loans is that you make interest-only payments on the amount that you borrowed throughout the duration and you can prepay at any time without penalty.
Buck: And what's the typical you said it was four point six.
Zac: We have interest rates as low as four point five. The interest rates on borrowing USD vary according to your initial loan to value ratio. So if you have a hundred thousand dollars worth of Bitcoin we actually have three loan-to-value ratio options. You can borrow at a 50 percent initial loan-to-value ratio which would mean you're borrowing 50k, the interest rate on that will be eleven point two five, if you borrow thirty five percent of the value so 35k the interest rate is seven point nine, and if you borrow twenty five percent of the value of the interest rate is four point five percent per year.
Buck: Got it. In terms of you know the technical, so you basically pay that on a month-to-month basis and then in terms of contracts, are those also month-to-month loans or how does that work?
Zac: Those are one-year term loans well now it's the ability to renew without repaying the principal at the end of the term at current rates and our rates for those loans have always come down so far. So it's a one-year term loan BlockFi committed for a year at that rate your payments stay the same but you can prepay at any time without penalty.
Buck: Right. When do you do when would you do an actual sort of I guess a cap will call like what loan-to-value because you can go up to say you're borrowing at you know you're borrowing at the lowest rate you know you're at 4.5% you're borrowing see you know just for round numbers 100 Bitcoin you borrowed or you said 10 Bitcoin hundred thousand dollars but you only borrowed twenty-five thousand dollars at four point five percent, what if Bitcoin you know loses 50 percent of its value then what happens?
Zac: Well you wouldn't have a margin call based on on that example. If your loan to value ratio hits 70 percent that's when we have a margin call and the way the margin call works is our clients have the option to either post more collateral, pay down the loan using USD or some of the collateral that's posted for the loan or take no action. If they take no action there's a 72-hour window where we'll wait to see if the price recovers, if it does then no action is required, if the price keeps going down further then we will initiate a partial collateral sale to rebalance that LTV to a healthy level at the end of that window.
Buck: So in terms of the clients that you see doing this kind of stuff, I mean who are you seeing borrowing because you don't have a cap I mean you can on the borrow side, I mean and the rates don't really change like if you're depositing a hundred Bitcoin you're getting the same rate differences as somebody who's depositing ten for borrowing right?
Zac: That's right.
Buck: So who are the people who are putting I mean what are these businesses that are putting are using these loans who are the typical clients?
Zac: Sure so it's a mix of retail and corporate. On the retail side we actually did a survey recently on use cases and the number one use case about a third of our borrowers expressed is that they were using the funds that they borrowed to start a business, which we were really excited about. So the other popular use cases were investing in real estate, investing in other types of traditional assets like stocks and bonds, home improvement, larger purchases, vacations were all used cases, paying down higher cost debt was another use case, and then on the corporate side the loans are used for operating capital. So we have some mining companies that borrow from BlockFi. Other types of companies who you know maybe have crypto denominated inventory like exchanges or crypto ATM businesses our frequent borrowers from BlockFi and our loan sizes rearranged from you know as low as five thousand dollars all the way up to seven figures. So it's a pretty diverse group of borrowers.
Buck: So recently it sounds like you guys partnered with another company called Casa. What is Casa and I guess how does that benefit both companies?
Zac: Sure. So Casa is a leader in fighting self sovereign storage solutions for cryptocurrency owners so if you're alone that owns Bitcoin and to use a gold analogy. If you want to own gold but you keep it in your vault or in your backyard you want to have physical possession of it yourself if you want to do that same type of custody with Bitcoin. Casa has a solution that makes that really easy. Our partnership with Casa provides mutual benefits to clients on either side. So Casa clients are able to receive some discounts in terms of accessing BlockFi products and vice-versa BlockFi clients are able to receive discounts in terms of accessing kasam products and over time we'll build some things in to the user experience specifically on Casa’s platform that will make it you know a bit more seamless to interact with BlockFi products while you're on their platform. In general that partnership strategy is something that you'll see more of we think there are in the ecosystem that are specializing in areas that BlockFi's not focused on and doing things where we can provide benefits to clients on both sides is a win-win for us then and our clients.
Buck: Last thing I want to ask you about, last time I spoke to you, you had talked about the idea of potentially Bitcoin backed credit cards meaning like you know getting Bitcoin back instead of miles or dollars back. You guys any closer to that, because I definitely want one of those cards.
Zac: I'm so glad you brought it up. We're definitely closer, but we're not you're not going to have the card until like Q3 of next year probably. It's getting worked on, these things you know for better or worse they take a long time launching a credit program is no small feat you know we're working on it. We've identified some of the key partners that we'll be working with to bring that product to market it is going to happen and I share your sentiment like I wish I had it now.
Buck: Yeah seriously that'd be great. Well listen it was great talking you. So it's BlockFi.com and it's spelled like block and then fi and tell us you know tell us the process of doing is pretty simple okay how long does it take to apply for these things…
Zac: Yeah I mean nothing takes any time really. So you could come in and start earning interest and get a loan from us all in under five minutes. And we also have a client service team that's super responsive in in terms of communication however you want to communicate with them, over email, over the phone, over text message so you know don't don't hesitate to reach out to us. We're also on twitter. My twitter handle is BlockFiZac and our company twitter handle is @therealBlockFi so we're very active on those platforms and happy to chat with you there as well.
Buck: Zac Prince, thank you very much for being on Wealth Formula Podcast today.
Zac: Thanks for having me, Buck, I appreciate it.
Buck: We’ll be right back.
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Wealth Formula Episode 179: Buy, Borrow and Die: Bitcoin Style

Catch the full episode: https://www.wealthformula.com/podcast/179-buy-borrow-and-die-bitcoin-style/
Buck: Welcome back to the show everyone. Today my guest on Wealth Formula Podcast is Zack Prince. He's Founder and CEO of BlockFi. BlockFi bridges the gap between blockchain and the basic financial products that you're used to including interest-bearing accounts and loans. Zack, welcome to Wealth Formula Podcast. I think you we might have had you on before as a Consensus Network replay but first time on Wealth Formula Podcast specifically, so welcome.
Zac: Yeah, excited to be here, Buck. Thanks for having me. And it's good to chat with you again
Buck: Yeah so remind me how you got into this you know Bitcoin stuff in the first place, I mean you were as I understand you were a traditional finance guy right so where did the blockchain part come in?
Zac: Sure so I was I was working at a company in the FinTech world that provided data and technology solutions to institutional investors that wanted to participate in some of the new online lending platforms, whether they were real estate platforms or consumer lending platforms, and I kind of became the FinTech guy amongst my friend group and people would ask me you know should I invest in these real estate deals on fund rise or buy loans from Lending Club and I started writing a blog to share the information more efficiently with my friends basically and I started expanding a little bit writing about Robo advisory and some other things that were going on in the FinTech space and that's what led me to Bitcoin, and this is back in early 2015. I didn't start BlockFi until 2017 because I started following the market in the background, still working in traditional financial services in FinTech and then in early 2017 it started to feel like mainstream adoption was starting to happen in the crypto ecosystem. I'm started going to some meetups in New York City because at a certain point my wife said Zac, you're talking about crypto all the time and you're talking to me about it and I don't want to talk about it so you should find some other people to talk about this with. And the meetup composition started to change and in 2016 when I started going to these meetups it was the early crypto adopters you know libertarians, computer scientists and then in early 2017 I started to see some venture capitalists, some guys who had just left their job at Wall Street still wearing a suit, some more entrepreneurs and it was a really exciting time in the ecosystem, things like the Enterprise Ethereum Alliance were getting announced which had participation microsoft and a lot of other you know fortune 500 companies and I had started to believe in it. I was drinking the kool-aid a little bit so I decided to find a way to get involved in the space full-time and that's what led me to start BlockFi.
Buck: So I have to imagine that the response you got from the traditional finance people around that time when you started talking about the blockchain space and when you started being more and more involved with that was probably not a very positive response initially or did you did you experience some of that sort of you know rejection initially to what you were doing?
Zac: Yeah absolutely. But you know throughout my career this is now kind of the third emerging technology industry that I've worked in. I was originally an advertising technology starting like you know 15 years ago and I was in FinTech specifically the online lending side of FinTech which in its early days was called peer-to-peer lending and now in crypto. So having to do a lot of education explain it you know why something isn't crazy and it might work and here's why and here's the value proposition and here's what it is, I've gotten very used to that and comfortable with it. But yeah there were a lot of people who are like you know I've heard Bitcoin is only used by drug dealers and money launderers. I've heard that I'm supposed to care about blockchain and not Bitcoin. And you know at BlockFi we’re providing financial products into the market so it's a heavily regulated business so we also had to communicate with regulators. We had to explain to state regulators, federal regulators why what we were doing with Bitcoin and other cryptos than when you're doing these same types of things with assets that they're more familiar with.
Buck: So when you were talking to people back in, I don't know I guess 2016/17 and it's not a long time ago, it's only two years ago, but I have to imagine that the response or the you know the approach that people take to you when you speak to investors is very different. Has it become more mainstream in that regard for you know for big money investors?
Zac: It's absolutely become more mainstream you know the end of 2017 Q3/Q4. Point was going on that parabolic run it started to get covered everywhere, I mean it was on CNBC every day it was in Bloomberg New York Times Wall Street Journal. If you were paying attention to the financial industry and markets you heard about Bitcoin at that time if you hadn't heard about it before. So from a baseline of awareness perspective it got a lot better and then in 2018 you had a number of positive developments for the sector including one that I think is probably the most noteworthy which is that Bitcoin futures were listed on the CME the institutional investor perspective that's massive. You now have a well regulated well known super trustworthy venue where you can get exposure to this asset class, you also had companies like Grayscale bringing products to the market which are accessible to certain types of investors and their low bridge accounts and you started to see some adoption from companies like FinTech companies like Robin Hood and Square making Bitcoin available on their platforms. So the conversation has absolutely changed a lot and it's become less about whether or not this is something that's going to continue to exist whether or not it's something that was just a bubble and is going to die and now it's more about ok how is it going to get used how big could it get what are the interesting applications of it and what could have potentially disrupt in the traditional financial ecosystem.
Buck: So you know we had obviously following this you know pop in 2017, you know I actually like you kind of really got into this early 2017 so timing was pretty good I guess now regards. Good or bad depending how you look at it but I was there before before the parabolic move. And then we have you know then we followed this up with a crypto winter and and you know who knows if we're done with it, I guess we certainly are much better off than we were. You know a unit buddy it's funny Zac I don’t know if you remember this but I was about to, we'll talk about BlockFi specifically in a minute but, I was about to use BlockFi for borrowing because I like this idea of borrowing you know collateralized debt and collateralized debt on assets and buying something else. So I was about to do it and then Bitcoin lost a clip and I was like literally and I remember I was just emailing with somebody somebody over there and I was like sorry dude I guess I just sold it, I just sold all that Bitcoin I had and you sent one email back to me and it said “capitulation” but it you know and so now we're looking back at these we go down from 3,000 back up you know been sort of flirting around this 10,000 and it seems like we're kind of maybe that we're stuck there, maybe we're kind of out of winter, maybe we're in a holding pattern but it seems like to me that since that two years not only is the awareness increase but the development of the ecosystem itself is so much further advanced than it was in 2017. Is this an unusual case where the technology and maybe even the infrastructure is actually outpacing the price?
Zac: You know it's really hard to say. I would argue that in some ways it's typical. In other industries that showed a lot of promise where investors could you know participate maybe a little bit ahead of the adoption curve you saw crazy price run ups with the tech bubble and you know ‘99-2000 being the one that's kind of top of mind in recent memory and then on the other side of things, are we behind where the price should be now? It's really hard to say because this is kind of like a commodity type asset built on a payment network and valuing that is challenging and there's not a perfect model for for doing it today. It's not as easy as something that's cashflow producing but I'm incredibly bullish. I'm on record as saying at the beginning of this year that Bitcoin has only had one year in its 10-year existence where it had a lower low than the year before and parted this year around the low price for 2018 and I predicted that we would in the year had a higher price than where we started the year pretty soon and now we're up and you know around 300 percent from where we started the year. As that happens in investing is people frequently look at things on a year-to-year performance basis and when people are looking at Bitcoin even if all we do is stay around 10 K from here when they're looking at how Bitcoin performed rather than other relative to other assets at the end of 2019 it's probably going to look fantastic. And you also have an event coming up and in the summer of next year called The Halvening where basically the supply that's produced by miners is going to get cut in half and so if you believe in the stock the flow type models of valuation for Bitcoin that is usually a very big driver of price appreciation.
Buck: I believe May of 2020, right?
Zac: That's right.
Buck: In May of 2020. Can you just talked a little bit about that just so people know because people hear about it, I've been talking about it but I don't think that it really explained it.
Zac: Yeah and you know I'm not I'm not a computer scientist so I can explain it in a you know in a very simple…
Buck: No one else here is either.
Zac: So basically the way that new Bitcoin is created is through this process called mining. And it's analogous to mining gold except instead of finding a place in the earth where gold exists and then getting your trucks and mining equipment and digging it out of the ground, the way bitcoin is mined is using this computer program and there is now specialized computer hardware that's built specifically and optimized for mining Bitcoin. And you have this network of machines around the world where the input is energy into the mining hardware and the output is new Bitcoin and those miners are what provides the power for the payment network a Bitcoin to run and when we say that there is this event called The Halvening, what that basically means is that the output that's built into the Bitcoin program that the miners are receiving as their payment for contributing energy to the network, is going to get cut in half. So the miners are going to have the same you know relative input but the amount that they're receiving is going to get cut in half for that input. This should, if the demand side for Bitcoin remains equal, it should drive up the price and historically Bitcoin has had three of these Halvening events in its lifetime so far I believe and around each Halvening you have seen you know six months before or six months after a pretty material run up in price.
Buck: Yeah so it also goes along with that sort of that the entire idea that Bitcoin unlike you know other assets including gold is it's a deflationary asset ultimately and and that's one of the things that makes that happening really significant. Apart from and I have one more question before we get to block five which is apart from the Halvening, you know thing that's happening, what is maybe the biggest development or upcoming thing that's coming up that makes you the most bullish on the future of Bitcoin or blockchain in general?
Zac: Sure so I think I wouldn't actually point to any one specific thing, I would point to two broad trends. So one is institutional adoption and participation in the asset class and the other is better ramps for retail participation into the asset class and just focusing here you know on the US market because it really is an international story but just in the US market. In September we should have Bakkt launching their futures platform. Bakkt is owned by ICE, the Intercontinental Exchange, and there's a big core difference between their futures and the current futures that are available on the CME in that futures on Bakkt platform are going to be physically settled so that means that actual Bitcoin is going to be needed to facilitate the trading on Bakkt’s platform which does not happen on CMEs exchange so that's that should be a very positive catalyst in terms of demand for physical Bitcoin that could have an impact on the price. Also on the institutional side this year I believe earlier this year, the first pension fund made an investment into an asset management vehicle that was focused on investing in Bitcoin and private equity opportunities in the Bitcoin and blockchain sector. So that will be a trend.
Buck: Which pension fund was it?
Zac: It was in North Carolina so I think it was like the North Carolina Firefighters and the group that raised the money from them was Morgan Creek Digital it’s actually invested in BlockFi by Anthony Pompliano Twitter and Mark Yusko so that's on the institutional side. And then on the retail side you've seen FinTech companies like Square and Robin Hood offer Bitcoin trading to their users. But soon you will also have companies like TD Ameritrade E-Trade and others offer Bitcoin to their users sometimes be a partnership sometimes because they've built it directly. You also at some point might see progress made in terms of an ETF getting approved that would give retail investors in the US market exposure to Bitcoin in a really easy and familiar way. All of those things are tremendously positive catalysts and the caliber of people working on them only continues to increase. Talent was attracted into the sector very, very rapidly these days.
Buck: You know one question that leads me to is that all of this is happening with Bitcoin for the most part. Are alt coins in your opinion is that market coming back or is that something that we're gonna see probably select you know group of tokens projects emerge and then the rest will kind of just get left in the dust, what do you think?
Zac: I mean I'll tell you exactly what I'm doing with my portfolio and then I'll provide a bit more color. So my asset allocation in the crypto side of my investing is I'm like 90% Bitcoin 5% Ethereum and 5% B&B; which is the Binance right. So I'm super bullish on Bitcoin. I think that you know there's a chance that Ether makes a comeback specifically I think that a lot of the stable coins that have been launched have been built on Ethereum if you're not familiar with stable coins it's basically the concept of a dollar but on a blockchain which could be really really powerful because it creates the opportunity for the delivery of US dollar denominated financial services at a global scale not using the traditional banking rails. And then B&B; I mean Binance is the biggest and most successful exchange they have a history of innovating, creating new products, going fast and so I'm taking a bit of a flyer with them but I'm 90% Bitcoin. I don't think that I'm not bullish on any of the other all coins frankly I struggle to see you know the big upside I have heard whispers in the community that there's kind of like a new wave of altcoins 3.0 might emerge, you know could see some some good returns similar to what some of the ICOs did in 2017 but it's not an area of focus for me. So that's my view.
Buck: Yeah let's talk about BlockFi. Remind us exactly what BlockFi is.
Zac: Sure so we're a wealth management platform for crypto investors. Today we have two products that we offer. One product is analogous to a savings account from a traditional bank where you're able to earn interest on your holdings except on BlockFi, the assets instead of being dollars are bitcoin and Ether and we don't have FDIC insurance so it's not exactly the same risk profile as a savings account at a bank, but conceptually you're able to hold Bitcoin and an account with BlockFi and earn interest on it paid in Bitcoin every month. That's one product that we have. The second product that we have which you are alluding to earlier offers our clients the ability to borrow dollars secured by the value of their cryptocurrency and it's analogous to a securities backed loan or a liquidity access line in the traditional world except instead of securities we're taking Bitcoin or other digital assets as collateral and lending it rates as low as four point five lending USD that rates as low as four point five percent a year.
Buck: I wanna pick these apart a little bit if you don't mind. In terms of this savings account first of all is it just bitcoin or is it bitcoin, Ethereum?
Zac: We actually support three assets in the interest account currently Bitcoin, Ether and GUSD which is the stable coin from Gemini.
Buck: Got it. And talk about the interest because it's not one flat interest rate right it's different depending on how much cryptocurrency actually is held?
Zac: Correct so there's a tiered interest rate structure. Currently on Bitcoin for balances up to ten Bitcoin, we offer a six point two percent annual yield and for balances above ten Bitcoin it's a 2.2 percent annual yield. On Ether, for balances up to two hundred Ether it's a 3.3 percent annual yield and balances above two hundred Ether is 0.5% annual yield and for GUSD the stable coin it's an eight point six percent interest rate with no tier so yeah those are the different rates.
Buck: Why did, I mean was it just a matter of like an issue with people dumping like a thousand Bitcoin and trying to get six you know 6% of that, was it just too hard to you know make that a long-term part of the business model or why did the higher levels end up changing to a lower rate?
Zac: Sure so I wanted to function of market conditions and to it's a function of supply and demand. So we launched the interest account in March of this year. We were just starting to come out of the bear market and one of the things that happened as we switched from being in a bear market to being in a bull market is the futures switched from being in backwardation to contango which basically means that our institutional borrowers the groups that we lend to that enable us to pay the rate to depositors had less of a need they had less demand to borrow and they were willing to pay lower rates to borrow crypto than they were when we were building and planning to launch this product. The second thing that happened is we were surprised to the upside in terms of the level of interest that we received from depositors and especially depositors with very large sums of cryptocurrency. So to give you an example you know within a day or two of making the product available publicly, we had a number of groups that were depositing 5, 10, 15, 20 million dollars worth of Bitcoin and so the supply-demand that we have to manage is, the amount that we have on deposit relative to the size of this market that will borrow Bitcoin size of the market that will borrow Bitcoin is partially a function of market sentiments partially a function of number of trading venues and the liquidity profile and it's partially a function of you know BlockFi’s efforts in terms of sales and client development relationship management. So the supply side got a little bit ahead of the demand side on deposit and how much there was available to borrow so we made a few tweaks. We want to keep the 6%, 6.2% rate on Bitcoin available to as many people as possible for as long as possible so that's why we went with the tiered structure where we made it available on balances up to 10 and reduced it for balances above that.
Buck: Got it and the interest on that, when you say 6.2 percent that six point like it's all denominated in Bitcoin, you're not paying cash out right?
Zac: Correct so to use round numbers to provide an easy example you start on January first with a hundred Bitcoin in an account, by the subsequent January first you will have 106 point 2 Bitcoin in your account.
Buck: Yeah and that that's kind of neat too because then you're you know you're also getting potentially the upside of that you know I mean they made 6% but if you if you're really bullish on the market you could be potentially looking at a lot more than 6% on your money. How about in terms of the, is there like a you know do you do it sort of a month-to-month or six month or month you know year-long contracts for these things?
Zac: It's month-to-month. So the rates are subject to change on a monthly basis. We provide notifications at least a week in advance before the end of one month on what the rates will be for the subsequent month and people are able to you know withdraw any time without penalty. We reserve up to 7 days to process withdrawals but we've never taken more than one business day to process a withdrawal so they're pretty quick but not instant for security reasons and yeah it's pretty flexible.
Buck: How about the lump in the lending side how does how does that work? So now I've got like 10 Bitcoin and so I would deposit that I guess and you guys I understand that maybe that that goes into like a Gemini account or something, is that still how it works?
Zac: Correct so we have a partnership with Gemini for custody. So when you log into a BlockFi account you'll have a deposit address. When you send Bitcoin to that deposit address it actually goes directly into storage with Gemini. Gemini was the first custodian in the crypto sector to receive insurance against cyber hacks on their platform. They were also the first custodian to get to complete a SOC 2 compliance audit and they have a really long track record of custody billions of dollars worth of crypto without ever having any issues. So it goes directly to Gemini and then you're able to interact with block-wise platform to take any actions that you might deem necessary. So you can view your interest payments you can withdraw you can deposit more you can also take out a loan. So in terms of taking out a loan, if you have ten Bitcoin that's worth roughly a hundred thousand US dollars at this point in time, you can borrow up to fifty percent of that value in a US dollar loan which can be funded be a wire or stable coin and then the structure of those loans is that you make interest-only payments on the amount that you borrowed throughout the duration and you can prepay at any time without penalty.
Buck: And what's the typical you said it was four point six.
Zac: We have interest rates as low as four point five. The interest rates on borrowing USD vary according to your initial loan to value ratio. So if you have a hundred thousand dollars worth of Bitcoin we actually have three loan-to-value ratio options. You can borrow at a 50 percent initial loan-to-value ratio which would mean you're borrowing 50k, the interest rate on that will be eleven point two five, if you borrow thirty five percent of the value so 35k the interest rate is seven point nine, and if you borrow twenty five percent of the value of the interest rate is four point five percent per year.
Buck: Got it. In terms of you know the technical, so you basically pay that on a month-to-month basis and then in terms of contracts, are those also month-to-month loans or how does that work?
Zac: Those are one-year term loans well now it's the ability to renew without repaying the principal at the end of the term at current rates and our rates for those loans have always come down so far. So it's a one-year term loan BlockFi committed for a year at that rate your payments stay the same but you can prepay at any time without penalty.
Buck: Right. When do you do when would you do an actual sort of I guess a cap will call like what loan-to-value because you can go up to say you're borrowing at you know you're borrowing at the lowest rate you know you're at 4.5% you're borrowing see you know just for round numbers 100 Bitcoin you borrowed or you said 10 Bitcoin hundred thousand dollars but you only borrowed twenty-five thousand dollars at four point five percent, what if Bitcoin you know loses 50 percent of its value then what happens?
Zac: Well you wouldn't have a margin call based on on that example. If your loan to value ratio hits 70 percent that's when we have a margin call and the way the margin call works is our clients have the option to either post more collateral, pay down the loan using USD or some of the collateral that's posted for the loan or take no action. If they take no action there's a 72-hour window where we'll wait to see if the price recovers, if it does then no action is required, if the price keeps going down further then we will initiate a partial collateral sale to rebalance that LTV to a healthy level at the end of that window.
Buck: So in terms of the clients that you see doing this kind of stuff, I mean who are you seeing borrowing because you don't have a cap I mean you can on the borrow side, I mean and the rates don't really change like if you're depositing a hundred Bitcoin you're getting the same rate differences as somebody who's depositing ten for borrowing right?
Zac: That's right.
Buck: So who are the people who are putting I mean what are these businesses that are putting are using these loans who are the typical clients?
Zac: Sure so it's a mix of retail and corporate. On the retail side we actually did a survey recently on use cases and the number one use case about a third of our borrowers expressed is that they were using the funds that they borrowed to start a business, which we were really excited about. So the other popular use cases were investing in real estate, investing in other types of traditional assets like stocks and bonds, home improvement, larger purchases, vacations were all used cases, paying down higher cost debt was another use case, and then on the corporate side the loans are used for operating capital. So we have some mining companies that borrow from BlockFi. Other types of companies who you know maybe have crypto denominated inventory like exchanges or crypto ATM businesses our frequent borrowers from BlockFi and our loan sizes rearranged from you know as low as five thousand dollars all the way up to seven figures. So it's a pretty diverse group of borrowers.
Buck: So recently it sounds like you guys partnered with another company called Casa. What is Casa and I guess how does that benefit both companies?
Zac: Sure. So Casa is a leader in fighting self sovereign storage solutions for cryptocurrency owners so if you're alone that owns Bitcoin and to use a gold analogy. If you want to own gold but you keep it in your vault or in your backyard you want to have physical possession of it yourself if you want to do that same type of custody with Bitcoin. Casa has a solution that makes that really easy. Our partnership with Casa provides mutual benefits to clients on either side. So Casa clients are able to receive some discounts in terms of accessing BlockFi products and vice-versa BlockFi clients are able to receive discounts in terms of accessing kasam products and over time we'll build some things in to the user experience specifically on Casa’s platform that will make it you know a bit more seamless to interact with BlockFi products while you're on their platform. In general that partnership strategy is something that you'll see more of we think there are in the ecosystem that are specializing in areas that BlockFi's not focused on and doing things where we can provide benefits to clients on both sides is a win-win for us then and our clients.
Buck: Last thing I want to ask you about, last time I spoke to you, you had talked about the idea of potentially Bitcoin backed credit cards meaning like you know getting Bitcoin back instead of miles or dollars back. You guys any closer to that, because I definitely want one of those cards.
Zac: I'm so glad you brought it up. We're definitely closer, but we're not you're not going to have the card until like Q3 of next year probably. It's getting worked on, these things you know for better or worse they take a long time launching a credit program is no small feat you know we're working on it. We've identified some of the key partners that we'll be working with to bring that product to market it is going to happen and I share your sentiment like I wish I had it now.
Buck: Yeah seriously that'd be great. Well listen it was great talking you. So it's BlockFi.com and it's spelled like block and then fi and tell us you know tell us the process of doing is pretty simple okay how long does it take to apply for these things…
Zac: Yeah I mean nothing takes any time really. So you could come in and start earning interest and get a loan from us all in under five minutes. And we also have a client service team that's super responsive in in terms of communication however you want to communicate with them, over email, over the phone, over text message so you know don't don't hesitate to reach out to us. We're also on twitter. My twitter handle is BlockFiZac and our company twitter handle is @therealBlockFi so we're very active on those platforms and happy to chat with you there as well.
Buck: Zac Prince, thank you very much for being on Wealth Formula Podcast today.
Zac: Thanks for having me, Buck, I appreciate it.
Buck: We’ll be right back.
submitted by Buck_Joffrey to u/Buck_Joffrey [link] [comments]

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